AfterDawn: News

Next gen format talks leans toward Blu-Ray disc structure

Reuters is reporting that talks between Toshiba Corp. and Sony over developing a unified next generation DVD format are leaning towards a disc structure supported by Sony. In case you have been living in a cave for the last few years, you should know that both companies have been promoting their technology as the best for consumer needs for a next generation DVD format standard. However, both sides would like to avoid a format war that would resemble the VHS-Beta videocassette war.

Several major companies back Sony's technology including Dell, Samsung and Philips. A source told Reuters that it was unclear whether both sides would ultimately reach an agreement on a common format but talks right now lean towards a unified format based on Blu-ray's disc structure. The Nihon Keizai newspaper reported earlier this week that both sides were in final talks over a possible format that would merge Blu-Ray's disc structure and Toshiba's software for copy protection and data transfer.



At the core of both formats are blue lasers, which have a shorter wavelength than the red lasers used in current DVD equipment, allowing discs to store data at the higher densities needed for high-definition movies and television.

Source:
Reuters

Written by: James Delahunty @ 11 May 2005 5:22

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• 18 comments

• jimmyjojo

  Which ever format has backwards compatibility with DVD wins my dollars. Period.

  11.5.2005 06:03 #1

• Rosco404

  Jimmy they wont be backwards compatible with DVD as they are not DVDs they are "HD-DVD" and "Blu-ray" they are a totaly differant structure to the DVD format out now.... As for DVD home players we have now we would have to buy new ones so they are able to read thses next generation discs... The new Home players will most probably be backward compatible so they can read normal DVD discs and also HD-DVD and Blu-ray discs....
  Remember the lasers in our devices at the moment will only read and write with a red laser NOT a Blue laser mechanism.
  As for our PCs we will have to buy new optical drives, for example BD-ROMs, BD-RW Drives... as like the home dvd players i would expect these to be backward compatible with our current media types also... But lets wait and see : )

  11.5.2005 08:38 #2

• nonoitall

  Actually there were plans to make HD-DVDs backwards compatible. I agree that backwards compatibility is going to be a big plus if it's used. Many people are just now getting DVD players (or still have yet to get them) and they won't want to have to buy brand new technology just a few months after they last updated.

  11.5.2005 10:44 #3

• Ludikhris

  Reality.
  
  They know that pushing a new format this soon is risky, so you will, at least at first, see all the new players be playing both. What do I mean? Even though a blue laser assembly wont read red laser discs they will make the players have both somehow so that they play both. Virtually nobody is going to want to upgrade again this fast.
  
  Also we have to consider the fact that a person with a regular television is not going to see much difference between a DVD hooked up with Composite cords (RBG) and a Blue-Ray Video played on the same regular television (thats also assuming a 3comb filter on the television). Therefore the market is now wittled down to people with HDTVs the larger the screen the more the difference. I dont know about you guys but I dont have a couple grand to throw down right now for a new television just so I can watch the new format discs.
  
  If they make the players dual format (not backwards compatible, there is a difference) they will get a lot of people that dont need the blueray function but are much more willing to pay for it knowing they can play there DVDs. Its added value to the product.
  
  Sony did the same thing with the PS2. When I first bought one I had 2 PS2 games, and mostly played my PSX games. Now I haven't touched a PSX game in about a year. It made the console more attractive and the switch MUCH more smooth.
  
  It will happen.
  
  Ludikhris

  11.5.2005 12:00 #4

• solargame

  how can they be backwards compatable when the regular burners have large red lasers and the new editions have hi-def blue lasers which are al lot finer. it could not be able to burn on a dvd becuase the data would be written on margins not data areas.

  11.5.2005 17:56 #5

• Ludikhris

  youre talking about burners.... im talking about players. It would be much easier to make dual format players than dual format burners, which I doubt they will EVER do.
  
  Ludikhris

  11.5.2005 19:17 #6

• AtariBorn

  Don't be surprised. I remember, back in the day, when people claimed it wasn't feasible to have both a DVD player and a CD writer in the same drive (due to functionality, practicality or cost efficiency). And now, just a few years down the line, they're widespread and almost cheap as dirt.

  11.5.2005 23:25 #7

• DMW

  Back in January Pioneer were showing off there new drives and they said they will be able to play and record most DVD formats and Blu-ray.
  
  They were only prototypes, but the thought is there to make it play and record most formats, so I think the transition will be quite smooth if they go this way.
  
  Cheers.

  12.5.2005 00:37 #8

• ddrhazy

  Probably all the new blue lazer players/roms will be backwards with dvds/cds, but it does increase the cost of the units a bit to be able to be backwards compatible. I read a year back that Sony was considering not having DVD-Video playback on their next gen system to bring down the cost of the system.
  
  And the usefulness of Blue-disc is pretty incredible. I mean forget watching High Definition which most people still haven't made the switch too. You'll now be see the ability to put whole series of shows on one disc! That's pretty cool in my opinion. I know I could use it for some anime series where the episodes range in the 300's and it takes like 10 DVDs in divx to fit them all. Now you're talking about dividing the amount of discs you need by 6. Can't wait...

  12.5.2005 00:50 #9

• GrayArea

  Seems like the manufacturers could add a red laser assembly to the head in these players and not have it add that much to the price. Those who want backwards compatability may have to pay a bit more. If the demand is there someone will build it.

  12.5.2005 08:25 #10

• wolf123

  dual format and backwards compatible are the same thing hello I think that blueray is cool just think not buying 7 disk buy one disk with the whole 22 episodes on one disk that is cool. I think its a given too think that you will be ablre too play the dvds out in the market now with the new players its been what 8 years since dvds were out and little longer for the really rich. "not me"

  12.5.2005 10:31 #11

• Ludikhris

  Actually backwards compatibility would be, for example, using a single laser to play old as well as new. Dual format would be that but also could mean using two separate lasers to play two types of media with the electronics product. Dual format can be backwards compatibility but backwards compatibility IS NOT necessarily dual format. Think of the dual head DVD/VCRs. They are dual format because they play two types, but they are not backwards compatible because the DVD player is not playing the VCR tapes. That is where the difference is.
  
  Blue-ray players wont be backwards compatible (they wont, by themselves, play DVDs) however if they add dual format to them (another laser assembly or something) they will be able to play DVDs. They still arent backwards compatible, but they would be dual format.
  
  Ludikhris
  Ludikhris

  12.5.2005 12:12 #12

• wolf123

  But is PS2 dual format or backwards compatible hello backward compatible so it problbly be possible maybe instead of havinving 2 laser eyes have the blue laser some how change too read the dvd format we have now making it backwards compatible.

  12.5.2005 15:38 #13

• Ludikhris

  I blue laser is not going to read PS2 and PSX games, its just not how it works. DVD lasers are red, Blue-ray are blue, because of the difference in frequency due to color etc there will need to be more than one laser. Im pretty sure however that they only need 1 eye for the laser assembly, they just need to find a way to change which comes out of the eye. If I remember right CD and DVD are different as well which is why there are two different pots on the bottom of a PS2 lens one for CD one for DVD. This is also why PS2s can stop playing DVDs but still play CDs, they are different. They can call it backwards compatible all they want, its dual format because it is separate.
  
  Wireless g adaptors are backwards compatible with b routers, they arent dual format. They meet the specifications to operate a certain level, then exceed it. With a dual format device it is something that does two different things with two different devices. The PS2 is multi format.
  
  In a sense the PS2 is both though if you think about it. Some PS2 games came out as CDs, so the same set of PS2 equipment that plays PS2 cds plays PSX cds, so that is backwards compatible. However the DVD part does not play the PSX games because it is something completely different, therefore it (by itself is neither dual format nore backwards compatible). Its a confusing issue that really depends on how you look at it.
  
  For instance, a PS2 in its entirety could be considered both backwards compatible and dual format. However, when you start to look at the parts and narrow it down at the core it is a multi format system. Kinda like an economical monopoly. If you think about it everything is a monopoly if you are specific enough, a gallon of milk at a 7-11 is a monopoly if you have no legs and walk on your fingers and can only travel to that particular store. With backwards compatibility vs dual/multi format its kinda the opposite the closer you look the more the real truth becomes apparent. An odd metaphore i know, but it kinda works.
  
  Ludikhris

  13.5.2005 00:53 #14

• wolf123

  PS2 is backward compatible
  
  Backward compatible (or sometimes backward-compatible or backwards compatible) refers to a hardware or software system that can successfully use interfaces and data from earlier versions of the system or with other systems. For example, Perl, the scripting language, was designed to be backward compatible with awk, an earlier language that Perl was designed to replace.
  Backward compatibility is more easily accomplished if the previous versions have been designed to be forward compatible, or extensible, with built-in features such as hooks, plug-in, or an application program interface (API) that allows the addition of new features.
  
  The term backward combatible (notice the "b") is sometimes used to describe hardware or software that is designed without regard for compatibility with earlier versions, causing the two versions to fight (or combat) each other. In this case, the two versions cannot share data easily and may have features that cause errors or crashes when they are installed on the same computer, often because the computer does not understand which version is being referred to. Even if the earlier version is removed, remaining vestiges of it may cause problems in running the newer version.
  
  
  Just one other thing a PS2 game is made on a DVD and the ps1 is made on a cd thats why there was some compatibility issues when it first came out and I think there are a ps1 games that dont even work.
  
  Another thing its possible too have the DVD players play the old ones because if you think people are going out and just going to drop another couple hundred dollars on something that only plays one format your nuts people are going too wait till its perfected anyway and enough media that even available.

  13.5.2005 02:58 #15

• xdragoon

  Old news.... heard about this 8 months ago. The new dvds are said to have a capacity of 20Gb or 40Gb. Forgot the exact measure.

  14.5.2005 17:02 #16

• wolf123

  50

  14.5.2005 21:23 #17

• nonoitall

  Or 25 for single-layer.

  14.5.2005 22:19 #18