UK 'Unlikely' To See 20gb PS3

UK 'Unlikely' To See 20gb PS3
UK buyers may only be offered the 60gb, fully-featured version of the up and coming PlayStation 3 console, according to a Sony official.

The head of Sony Computer Entertainment's UK operation, Ray Maguire, seemed to confirm speculation that the less featured 20GB PS3 will not be released in the UK officially in an interview with UK games industry weekly MCV. "The lower-end 20Gb version of PlayStation 3 has no wi-fi, no HDMI and none of the other slots in it, so it’s really a question of where we would position it. It’s more likely that we will only launch the 60Gb version," he stated.



Last week, Maguire was quoted as saying the 60GB PS3 will be priced at around £425 when it arrives in the UK on 17 November. His latest comments, however, imply a lot of uncertainty regarding the final price. "We have time to watch the yen and be flexible, but that 60GB version looks like £425 in the UK at the moment," Macguire told MCV. "High trade margins in the UK are likely to see it come in with that kind of street price, though it's ultimately up to retailers."

Source:
The Register

Written by: Ben Reid @ 23 May 2006 11:50
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  • 60 comments

  • Lethal_B

    I think not releasing a lesser-featured, cheaper ps3 would be a huge mistake. Not everybody has £425 to spend on a games console..

    23.5.2006 11:58 #1

  • sukhvail

    yes i agree. the 425 pound one just isnt an option for many people especially for me because that turns out to over 800 cdn!! and i dont have that kind of money to drop on a game console

    23.5.2006 12:05 #2

  • rav009

    They'll release a 40gb version if they know whats good for them!

    23.5.2006 12:23 #3

  • JXP2307

    I agree that releasing only the more expensive model might hurt sales...

    Maybe they look at it from a different angle. You don't have to sell as many if they cost more.

    23.5.2006 12:43 #4

  • FlakMNKEY

    Death to sony. I don't have a HDTV so i don't care about either side on that issue. what it comes down to is games and price. The games I am interested in Mainly EA sports games, some fps and rpg's microsoft has already. If microsoft would have never had EA on board it might be different. No need to waste my money on something that is equal technology wise to the xbox 360.

    The only great benefit for people who buy the ps3 and play games online - they are not going to have to deal with obnoxious and loudmouth litte turds running their mouth. because most people can't afford that or are not willing to pay for it.

    greatest downfall. why would you want to buy this when it looks as if no one wants it due to the price. there's going to be no one online to play against.

    I think I can safely say that Microsoft already has the console war won. I even bet Nintendo comes in second. I think hollywood needs to rethink the HD-DVD format. because more people will have it once the HD drive comes out for the 360. 2 things I really want. 1. A trip to Alaska, 2. HDTV. Once i get those ill consider a next gen dvd player and ill probably side for microsoft just for the price.

    I'm not even interested in most of the new games coming out for the 360 but I love xbox live arcade. If they keep cranking out the classics. I will only be buying madden and ncaa every year.

    23.5.2006 12:55 #5

  • nitrous3

    now UK has to pay even more!

    23.5.2006 13:03 #6

  • nitrous3

    now UK has to pay even more!

    23.5.2006 13:04 #7

  • nitrous3

    now UK has to pay even more!

    23.5.2006 13:04 #8

  • nitrous3

    I accidently clicked POST 3 times. Sorry

    23.5.2006 13:08 #9

  • borhan9

    Well i think this will be the downfall of the ps3 in the UK.

    Eventually people are goin to figure how to install alternate hdd and then mod them themselves :)

    23.5.2006 13:41 #10

  • lcarbutt

    I was going to buy one<<<<"was" being the main word. £425 OMG :(

    23.5.2006 15:13 #11

  • OzMick

    Ha, a guy at my work was all excited about getting one, saying it was only a little more than the 360 for the cheaper model... Then I told him about the fact the Blu-ray drive is useless, essentially providing DVD quality anyway and that the wifi is gimped out of it.

    I personally think Sony isn't going to release it anywhere, it is just a bit of a marketing spin to soften the blow of the huge price jump from the 360. If they do they're just going to gather dust anyway.

    23.5.2006 15:37 #12

  • rihgt682

    What's up with the old picture?

    23.5.2006 17:14 #13

  • sanders66

    I think they should offer all packages to everyone world wide.

    23.5.2006 17:59 #14

  • ZippyDSM

    SIcne the PS3 has no reigioning you could import it, that would only be 50 USD more? I eman its better than gettign the 600$ monster that wont paly on reg TVs *L*

    24.5.2006 01:16 #15

  • ZippyDSM

    OzMick
    Frankly 100-200 more for a consoel is nothing the price diffrance in teh PS2 and the gamcube was almost 150 when they frist came out so meh the price is not an issue.... do I have the money hell no.

    Besides the state of gameing has been dieing the past 4 or so years eveyhting is mvoeing to graphics and leaveing gamepaly,fun,creativity behind both the 360 and PS3 suffer frommroe thigns than jsut the console,altho in the long run I think Sony missed the ball on the PS3 frist off it would have been easier to make the 60GB one with a simple analog output not mess with the HDMI or anything just have a adapter that plus into it and give you Composite thu Svid and sell it for 500 or better yet aculty work on the tech and make a device/adapter that can convert its HDMI into Composite thru DVI this 2 version shceme annoys me.....the HDless 360 is as pointless.....unhhggggg

    24.5.2006 01:24 #16

  • Mik3h

    IMHO, Microsoft are winning this console war now that PS3 are going to be costing £425. I think the 360 will lower their prices when PS3 does come out, so many people that were waiting on a PS3, will see the cost and just go for a 360.

    -Mike

    24.5.2006 03:33 #17

  • OzMick

    Zippy:
    Comparing the cube and PS2 or Xbox is like comparing apples and oranges. Aside from the fact they had a few multiplatform games, they didn't compete, the cube was the second one you bought BECAUSE it was cheap, and some of the exclusive titles are fun. I know I did, and a lot of friends did too. Microsoft themselves have said at E3 this year that they aren't competing with the Wii, in fact they support it, they want it to be something you can get as well as the Xbox, all for less than a PS3.

    You pretty much proved the point yourself that money is an issue when it comes to buying when you said that you can't afford it.

    24.5.2006 05:01 #18

  • ZippyDSM

    OzMick
    I dotn ahve 400 for the 360 either add 50$ for S/H unless MS is willign to apy for pickup in the boonies if it goes bad...meh

    Also the PS3 is uneven if I get the 600 version I am sure as hell not goign to upgrade my TV and shit,they are palying prive shcemes and other thigns its rather annoying....to me its simple have it where to runs well on old and new tvs since Digi TVs are far from mainsteam why risk loseing sales over it uhg......I mean with all the crap they have done to amke the PS3 low end version why not jsutmake it without a BR drive to at least then it would be 200 something.....

    The 360 has enough issues of its owen but the PS3 has added a ton of unessery issues to itself.....its jsut nuts

    Mik3h
    the only problem with that is the 360 suxs game wise and will pretty much sux game wise comapred to everythign the PS3 will have,however it dosent seem either system is worth 200 right now.....
    At best I might be willing to pay 300 for next gen stuff but I'd be better off fillign the gaps in my collection that fooling with next gen stuff...

    24.5.2006 05:35 #19

  • hughjars

    As I said yesterday.

    The US market price of the 60gb PS3 ($599) 'translates' to approx £320 at today's currency rates, not £425.

    The UK rip-off continues.

    See how much this insanely weird and wholly imaginery 'love' for a foreign corporation means in reality?

    (.....and what are the bets the 'blu ray DVD' player turns out to be a similar level of 'quality' (don't laugh too hard) as the DVD player in the PS2 was compared 'normal' DVD players available, huh?)

    24.5.2006 06:51 #20

  • Lethal_B

    To save £105, it may be worth purchasing your PS3 in America, or from America. It is astounding that UK customers should have to pay so much more than its' American friends.

    24.5.2006 09:09 #21

  • William77

    I live in Thailand and after finding out the price was going to be $600 U.S. dollars I started puting $25 away every friday its not much and when november rolls around I'll have more than enough money to buy the PS3. You have alot of time just put whatever you can back every week.

    24.5.2006 11:13 #22

  • domie

    "To save £105, it may be worth purchasing your PS3 in America, or from America"

    of course that is an option to consider but i feel the dvantages are outweighed by the disadvantages of having to deal with
    - voltage changes (110 v to 240 v)
    - plug adapters (two pin to three pin)
    - possible region codes ( from region 1 to region 2)
    - 17.5 % VAT import duty

    24.5.2006 16:22 #23

  • ZippyDSM

    Lethal_B
    Frist off Sony is a Japanase coperation,2nd US coperations owen the US.

    domie
    PS3 has no regoining
    Any UK gamer kinda already needs the US to UK power changer the UK,mostly becuse the with the limited amunt of games the UK soemtiems gets its jsut eaiser to start a new system from the US and import its games.

    ouch I wish we imposed a freaking import tax mabye a 50% tax on everythign from china >< ....but I diagress ..in the long run you'd be better off with a US system or a moded one at least the PS3 has out growen regoining ><.

    24.5.2006 17:34 #24

  • sammorris

    £425 but up to the retailers means £449.99. At that price, it's going to be a Lik-Sang job.

    26.5.2006 15:07 #25

  • ZippyDSM

    sammorris
    Do you know if the games are regoinless?
    They have confrimed the moives are,but I cant find anythign abotu the games

    26.5.2006 23:59 #26

  • muckluck

    I really don't understand why everyone is going nuts about the nextgen systems. I've been following it a lot, and i've seen the PS2 launch and the PSP launch, and even with all this talk, just look at it this way. If you take the time to type something here, that means your're into games. If you have an xbox, a PS2, or a gamecube, just enjoy it. Play all those games you haven't beaten yet, and wait for the good games that are about to come. (well not for xbox, really) I'm still waiting on FFXII for PS2, and god of war 2, and all my friends want that zelda for their gamecube.

    Come on people, just enjoy the great games on the great systems you have now, they're already in your hands! instead of arguing which nextgen system will do best. These are 3 hudge companies who know what they're doing. Just sit back, start to play a good game, and enjoy the anticipation.

    27.5.2006 10:32 #27

  • sammorris

    regoinless? Sorry you'll have to tell me what that means. If you meant regionless, I'm not sure, but I can tell you that if they are, then there'll probably be some hack before long, or you could buy a PS3 from Lik Sang, or is that what you're planning on doing? Not sure tbh, we'll have to see.
    muckluck: We can and do play our current systems but what's wrong with discussing the next gen systems? Gamers like ourselves are clearly excited by the prospects... Lol about the xbox!

    27.5.2006 14:26 #28

  • ZippyDSM

    muckluck
    but but but we like to complain *L*
    its ture tho wasnt the PS2 launch at 500?So meh I am focuseing on the stupidty of the companies and the games ^^
    MS bad luanch quick low qauilty hardware ans other iusses are still clinging to it altho this time next year most of the hardware problems should be fixed.

    Sony has messed up pre launch with non normal High Def aproach the ow end can not do HD it might just might can do 720 but the high end can do normal HD with a HDMI adapter,there are just so many things wrong with releaseing 2 versions they should have just stuck with the high end at 500....


    sammorris
    "pelts you wif my brain or whats left of it"
    bah most of you guys are smart enough to figure out what I am saying...most of the time *L* :P

    Anyway I was reading on gamespot and they siad it is regionless gameing and moives so I'll add 70% truth to it god knows sony likes fudgeing things 0_o

    28.5.2006 00:00 #29

  • sammorris

    Well we'll see about the regions. The cost of the hardware is a lot though, despite its capabilities. I mean compared to a PC of the same spec even without the software it's a steal, but it may just be a bit too much for a games console. I think the 20GB cut down verson would sell well in the UK, especially if it was a fair bit less than £425, i.e. under £350.

    28.5.2006 02:27 #30

  • ZippyDSM

    sammorris
    their not goign to bring it to 400 anytime soon much less 350,they have bitten off a bit more than they can chew I think,but they will get by between the new tech nuts and die hard sony fans it will sell,I just dont like what they are offering,correction I dont like HOW they are offering it......

    if they wanted to they could go with a 300 version No extras (No HD,No wireless) just the Console,with 1 controller USB pad,the USB ports,the mem stick port,and a Muti AV out setup that aloows a adapter built for the PS3 to do DVI,HDMI,Compsite and such upgradeable if you will,they could sell the HDMI for 100,and the rest for 50 a pop and still amke as much money...nintendo is the only one with any foresight left but soemtiems thier sight is clouded by the shrooms they eat 0-o
    MS is following Sonys lead for the most part....

    28.5.2006 04:04 #31

  • Gazbin

    This system is seriously stretched with an untested Cell Processor and Blu-ray drive. Lets face it Sony wasnt ready to go into a next generation battle.

    The Cell is overly complex and has a large die size so expect it to get hot for comparably low CPU output. Right next to it is a heat generating NVidia GPU and next that it is sensitive Blu-ray player made of plastic to keep cost down. All of this is housed in a plastic case.

    What is the warranty? Is it 5-Years to match the HDTV Plasma screens, or is it 3-Years to match low cost consumer good brands such as LG & Samsung?

    No - The Warranty is just 12 months. Expect lots of read errors from that Blu-ray after 9 months.

    Forget about playing PSX or PS2 media or DVD movies in the Blu-ray. You will shorten the life of the drive mech too much. At the price you will pay for the PS3 and on top of the fact that games are costing US$10 - $30 more than XBOX 360 and up to $40 more than the latest released PC games - any PS3 buyers are in for some serious trouble.

    28.5.2006 04:40 #32

  • ZippyDSM

    Gazbin

    the DC was hellsihs to code for yet people still coded for it,as far as codeing goes its all in what Sony will share with the devs if theya re goign to be like sega was and not share alot of info and snub some devs sony will suffer from no game sells.

    And the 360 is preffect in the heat dispeenstion department?I'll bet a said PS3 that it has less hardware woes than the 360 did off the bat.

    Also the PS3 CPU is 6 or 7 cores so it dosne need to run at max MHZ.

    About the BR drive failing after a year....you gotme there I cant defend that point becuse sony is knowen for thier cheap assness,and I bet its a nightmare to repalce part son it unlike the 360 whitch has simple units to repalce ><

    28.5.2006 04:49 #33

  • OzMick

    The fact that it is 6-7 cores is because it starts out at 8 and due to poor quality manufacturing, cores are permanently disabled during testing. That alone starts to ring alarm bells for me, doesn't make me feel easy about it running well, quantity doesn't make up for lack of quality as far as I'm concerned...

    28.5.2006 05:23 #34

  • ZippyDSM

    OzMick
    you know they do that all the time with PC CPUs lock out the MHZ and such,I dont see a problem with that presay,the ture hadware test is the frst 6months to a year the system has been release a friend of mine in holland got his 360 and had it almost 2 months befor it died 0-o

    So the ture test of the PS3 is going to the frist year after lunch.

    28.5.2006 05:30 #35

  • sammorris

    ZippyDSM: I was tyalking about if they sold the 20GB not a price drop on the 60. I see your view and that's what I think would sell well here. Revolution and heaven forbid xbox 360 sales may be upped by that poor choice.
    Gazbin: Untested? It could have been brought out at the time of the 360, but they don't want it to be crap, so they have waited to make sure it IS tested. A large die size is good, we want big die, small transistors. The Cell will pwn anything present barring perhaps a dual Woodcrest. I shall expect no such troubles from the Blu-ray drive after 9 months. You can talk about poor quality drives. I wouldn't mind betting you can move a PS3 when there's a disc in it. Not so for a 360.
    ZippyDSM and Gazbin: I can't say Sony drives are that great, but my PS2 is going strong after 41 months and my Brother's only broke after 4 years, so they're not quite as bad as you make out. Although I must admit our Philips CD audio deck was working fine after 12+ years of service when we replaced it in 2003. A few segments didnt work in the LCD but apart from that, audio quality was still good.
    OzMick: I doubt poor quality manufacture, but it is unnerving having one disabled. Do they automatically re-enable themselves if one breaks?
    ZippyDSM: I agree on the testing, and it'll be about then when I'll buy one, post-flaw ironing and post make-the-price-reasonable-ing.

    28.5.2006 13:52 #36

  • ZippyDSM

    sammorris
    it seems 40/60 on the PS2 lasting for 4 or so years,altho they had more troubles with soem of thier revisions more than the frist model,but for the msot part I think the PS3 will be ok hardware wise at the most 1/3rd might have troubles with the BR drive in acouple years but thats about all I can see,as far as heat disspintion goes sony is not a stupid company arragont yes stupid not so much they will test thier lil monster correctly,but I wonder if they zone tested it you know palyed it for a few hours in a room thats 80 or so degress's,not everyone is goign to have a 70ish A/C cooled aera to play it in.

    I cant wait till it comes out the fanboys are a doubled edged sword and great beta testers...they also whine when thier system fails so with them playing the system with a minuim of life,work and sleep for hours on end a day we all well know soon if the hardware is good or needs fixing ^^

    28.5.2006 22:21 #37

  • sammorris

    Yeah I think that's about right, the first few consoles will have longevity problems, new tech always does. They should then be OK. Sony, as you say, don't care much for consumers, but they're not idiots, if there are heat problems then they'll sort them out sharpish, that's the idea of the delayed launch. Lol good call on the fanboys, they keep gaming alive (although it sickens me to say it!)

    29.5.2006 02:38 #38

  • ZippyDSM

    sammorris
    its that profalaxtant love they have for thier consoles ,their the best beta testers anyone could ask for...altho I dont think the systems run well when thier..um ...moist....LOL

    29.5.2006 02:56 #39

  • sammorris

    Now stop that! lol

    29.5.2006 03:29 #40

  • Gazbin

    Issue for Sony is that they don't have time to test & perfect this product. Microsoft pushed for an early next Generation arms race knowing that Sony was far from ready. Early announcements by both Sony & Nintendo was highly critical of Microsoft' rush to introduce new consoles.

    With Sony Consumer Electronics business loosing money they cannot afford to fall behind in the console business - the one area that is highly profitable. If Microsoft gets a big head start it will cause major issues for Sony's business model which is based on holding 2/3 market share. That is now in serious jeopardy, so they had to announce a pre-Christmas launch. Cell & Blu-ray ready or not they have to launch.

    Now the peak selling Christmas season is closing in and Sony still have not got final dev kits out to Developers. Even the last batch don't confirm what will be inside PS3 when it launches. As a result of the lack of Dev Kits and complex nature of Cell Processor, dissatisfaction among the software houses have started to leak out to the public domain - a true indication that Software partners are no longer staying exclusive to Sony.

    To counter escalating costs Sony has pitched that the Blu-ray more than compensates for a US$20-$40 premium over competing XBOX 360 and PC software titles. In addition, Developers are invited to include In-Game-Advertising into the games as an additional source of revenue to counter development costs. Microsoft is joining in on this with the acquisition of Massive – only Nintendo have questioned In-Game-Advertising saying that it was tacky. ** Personally I don't want Advertisements in games that I paid for.

    My feeling is that Nintendo may steal development time away from both MS & Sony because their DS & Wii are easy / low cost to develop for and the Wii also looks like being a volume play.

    Look, I'm not into the politics - but I do care that the PS3 is being rushed onto the market and will not be reliable. Sony is taking an arrogant "All Care - But no Responsibility" attitude – as always. If consoles break who will pay? The consumer. Prove me wrong Sony, offer a three Year Warranty.

    29.5.2006 04:01 #41

  • sammorris

    Gazbin: Not necessarily, Sony were admittedly less ready, but by the time the PS3 is released, it will be far more tested and proven than the 360 was at launch, so I don't expect anywhere near as many problems.
    In-game advertising I don't have a problem with unless its intrusive. I couldn't care less about the advert banners in the PC game RCT3 for example, it's a neat touch that adds to realism, but I don't want adverts being pkated between levels for example unless they take up no more time than a loading screen, in which case they are again, almost harmless, though some timescale for when the level will be ready would be nice.

    29.5.2006 04:31 #42

  • ZippyDSM

    sammorris
    stop what I am not a fan boy?? :P

    Gazbin
    the 360 is/was worse,I dont see that may great games 6 months after PS3 launch,I also dont se alot of hardware issues like the 360.

    In game advertazeing,meh depends on how, like sammorris 's says if its in yourface all the tiem and or steals game time,altho I dout any dev would make such a game...altho I can see acouple uber publishing houses try ><
    but this at the msot will be on a few games.

    Anyway I fel the PS3 is a monster of a console and should have greatgames for it,its just gong to take time for these games to be made as well as any kinks in the PS3 be polished out,as it stands sicne Sony is stubing its fans I can wait acouple years for one...

    29.5.2006 06:26 #43

  • sammorris

    You know what I'm on about! I doubt we will have to worry too much about IGA, it won't be allowed to become too intrusive, and if it does, people will hack it out. Agree exactly on the PS3, regardless of what shortfalls it has, consoles have never been such rivals for the power of PC gaming. £425 wouldn't buy you half a PC that can play most top titles at proper detail at 1280x720.

    29.5.2006 07:26 #44

  • Gazbin

    sammorris: I cannot believe how easily people give up their rights. Does anyone know the difference between Free-to-Air TV and Pay TV? Why would you pay $100+ for a game AND let the publisher put advertisements in it. Amazing. I love the new generation - they are such good suckers.

    "So long as it's not in your face Advertisements"?? OK so let us say you buy a game next year and you do find a game where the Advertisements are in your face - What are you going to do about it then? Cry? Ask for a refund? Check your licensing agreement you accepted. Mate if you give an inch they take a mile. Bend over? You may, but not me. "Adverts adds to realism" My ass.

    Now let's say the online component includes Spyware (lets call the program RootusersKit-2) How would you feel that personal details and your gaming & movie preferences are fed to marketers. What games you like to play, when and with who. What movies you watch - You wouldn't care would you? Can I have your credit card details by the way?

    Anyway enough ranting - that's just how I feel.

    RE: XBOX & PS3 reliability. XBOX360 uses a standard DVD-ROM. The High Def DVD option is an external device with separate power source). PS3 has an internal 1st generation Blu-ray disk that has a far higher bit area density and hence far lower physical & environmental tolerances compared with conventional DVD. This sensitive device (which will be made entirely of plastic because of cost constraints) is going to sit next to a very hot Cell Processor (large die size = consumes more power = more heat generation) and an NVidia GPU. All of these devices will draw power off the same source. I see a difference.

    Now all I'm suggesting here is that maybe the Blu-ray is going to be a little flaky reading PSX, PS2, and DVD's - Sony is going to blame the condition of your media when things start to go wrong and the drive make the whirring sound.

    Before you know it, 12 months have whizzed by and the load time on those Blu-ray disks start to take longer and longer. At the price they are charging - I'd be demanding 3-Years warranty at least.

    30.5.2006 03:55 #45

  • Gazbin

    In my rave I left out that the XBOX 360 uses an external power supply. It has a huge size power source with a physical volume of 1300cm. Yes the 360 still had a lot of heating issues - My point is that the PS3 power source is internal...

    Also want to stress that both Sony & MS are pushing the in-game-advertising thing. Sony is also not the only corporate that feels they have the right to imbed Spyware into their products. Google: "Microsoft Spyware Bill". Difference is Sony has already used it.

    The Blu-ray in the PS3 will need to calibrate a red laser & blue laser (for CD, DVD / BD-ROM) - it's more complex than the DVD which has had 10 years to get somewhat reliable.

    Bottom line for me:

    I'm buying a Nintendo Wii and will upgrade my PC to the new AMD Dual Core. I'm waiting for Crysis, Spore, & Unreal Tourney 2007.

    30.5.2006 05:01 #46

  • sammorris

    Quote:I cannot believe how easily people give up their rights. Does anyone know the difference between Free-to-Air TV and Pay TV? Why would you pay $100+ for a game AND let the publisher put advertisements in it. Amazing. I love the new generation - they are such good suckers.How do you mean? We pay hand over fist for a TV subscription riddled with adverts. The only safe channels are the free BBC ones and the Sky Movies / Box Office channels.
    Quote:"So long as it's not in your face Advertisements"?? OK so let us say you buy a game next year and you do find a game where the Advertisements are in your face - What are you going to do about it then? Cry? Ask for a refund? Check your licensing agreement you accepted. Mate if you give an inch they take a mile. Bend over? You may, but not me. "Adverts adds to realism" My ass. They do in RCT3, not all cases but that's one. If adverts are stupidly in your face I'll hear about it and either put up with it or not buy the game. I don't just rush headlong into games without reading up on them first.
    Quote:Now let's say the online component includes Spyware (lets call the program RootusersKit-2) How would you feel that personal details and your gaming & movie preferences are fed to marketers. What games you like to play, when and with who. What movies you watch - You wouldn't care would you? Can I have your credit card details by the way? Yep, here's the number... What are we going to do about it, mount a lawsuit?
    Quote:RE: XBOX & PS3 reliability. XBOX360 uses a standard DVD-ROM. The High Def DVD option is an external device with separate power source). PS3 has an internal 1st generation Blu-ray disk that has a far higher bit area density and hence far lower physical & environmental tolerances compared with conventional DVD. This sensitive device (which will be made entirely of plastic because of cost constraints) is going to sit next to a very hot Cell Processor (large die size = consumes more power = more heat generation) and an NVidia GPU. All of these devices will draw power off the same source. I see a difference. Nice, compact and free from fires on my carpet. Suits me fine!

    Quote:Now all I'm suggesting here is that maybe the Blu-ray is going to be a little flaky reading PSX, PS2, and DVD's - Sony is going to blame the condition of your media when things start to go wrong and the drive make the whirring sound. and if they do, then they can sod off. Too damn right. But I doubt things will become as bad as you make out.
    Quote:Before you know it, 12 months have whizzed by and the load time on those Blu-ray disks start to take longer and longer. At the price they are charging - I'd be demanding 3-Years warranty at least.Lets see how long your 360 manages too.
    Quote:In my rave I left out that the XBOX 360 uses an external power supply. It has a huge size power source with a physical volume of 1300cm. Yes the 360 still had a lot of heating issues - My point is that the PS3 power source is internal... So what? So the PS3 gets a tad warm while your carpet is on fire. I can't have a power brick on a cable where my console is, I actually cant have one, the wire goes down a good metre vertically, ive seen people suspend power bricks in the air, not for me thanks.
    Quote:Google: "Microsoft Spyware Bill". Difference is Sony has already used it. and M$ will charge you for the ability to have it.
    Quote:The Blu-ray in the PS3 will need to calibrate a red laser & blue laser (for CD, DVD / BD-ROM) - it's more complex than the DVD And better which has had 10 years to get somewhat reliable. So? if you never move on, you effectively have a permanently broken high def drive, because you don't actually have one. Ever thought of that?
    Quote:Bottom line for me:

    I'm buying a Nintendo Wii and will upgrade my PC to the new AMD Dual Core. I'm waiting for Crysis, Spore, & Unreal Tourney 2007.     I'm also going to upgrade my PC to an X2 4200+ and buy UT2007. Sounds like we have something in common. I may get a Wii too, depending on how much money I have.

    30.5.2006 12:04 #47

  • Gazbin

    Gents, PS3 is indeed very very broken and it appears to be worse than we all suspected - this news just in. Published by the Inquirer and showing internal Sony documentation. Matches Sony's latest spin that "they don't care about market share"... They won't have any.

    PS3 hardware slow and broken
    In words and pictures

    AFTER BREAKING THE news to me about PS3 RSX speeds earlier on the flight to Japan, my row-mate said 'if you think that's interesting, wait till you see this. Cell is hurting, badly'.
    For those of you that believe in religions with karmic tendencies, scoops like this meant one of two things, the wings of the plane are about to fall off and I am going to die in a fiery ball, or worse yet, the movie selection will be worrisome. Cell memory access appears to be broken, RSX has half the triangle setup rate of the ATI chip in XBox360, and the true horror, Big Momma's House 2 and a Queen Latifa movie.
    With the movie selection still making my brain throb from the glances I caught, I furiously took notes on what the source was saying. He started out saying that the RSX can only write about half as much vertex data as it can fetch, not an ideal situation by any stretch, but survivable.
    Then came the horrible news, RSX appears to be limited to setting up 275 Million triangles/second, anemic compared to the 500+ million in XBox360. When asked about this apparent thumping dished out by MS, the reply from one notable ISV relations boffin was a terse 'What a Piece of Junk'. Talk about a steak in the heart.
    Half the triangle setup capability in the PS3, could things get worse? Yes, far far worse, how about another disparity of three orders of magnitude? No, I am not joking, looking at Sony's own figures, Cell appears to be pretty badly broken.

    For main memory, it looks like Cell has about 25GBps of main memory bandwidth, and RSX is about 15-20GBps. Achievable bandwidth is between about two thirds of that and nearly 100%, clearly the elves in the caves surrounding Rambus central did something right with XDR. That is the happy news.
    For local memory, the measured vs theoretical bandwidth is missing, I wonder why? RSX is at a solid 22.4GBps for both read and write, good job there green team. Then comes the blue team with Cell. Local memory write is about 4GBps, 40% of the next slowest bandwidth there. Then comes the bomb from hell, the Cell local memory read bandwidth is a stunning 16MBps, note that is a capital M to connote Mega vs a capital G to connote Giga. This is a three order of magnitude oopsie, and it is an oopsie, as Sony put it "(no, this isn't a typo...)".
    If you can write at 250x the read speed, it makes Cell local memory just about useless. That means you do all your work out of main memory, and the whole point of local is, well, pointless. This can lead to contention issues for the main memory bus, and all sorts of nightmarish to debug performance problems. Basically, if this Sony presentation to PS3 devs shown to us is correct, it looks like PS3 will be hobbled in a serious way.
    The next slide goes on to say "Don't read from local memory, but write to main memory with RSX(tm) and read it from there instead", and repeats the table numbers. This is very very bad. The number of times the presentation goes on to say that it is correct, and the lack of anything like "this will be fixed by production steppings, so take measures X, Y and Z" say to me that it is not a fixable snafu. Remember at E3 when I said that the PS3 demos there were object sparse? Any guesses why?
    Someone screwed up so badly it looks like it will relegate the console to second place behind the 360. All the devs I talked to were lukewarm on the 360 architecture but universally negative on the PS3. Revelations like this go a long way to explain why you keep hearing about simmering problems from the Sony devs.
    You end up with a console with half the triangle setup rate of the 360, a crippled CPU that is a bitch to program, and tools that are atrocious compared to the 360. To make matters worse, you have an arrogant set of execs telling us that twice the price is worth it for half the power, a year late. If it isn't already too late, Sony had better do something about this recto-cranial inversion or it may very well sink the console

    5.6.2006 01:10 #48

  • sammorris

    Oh look, the Inquirer's appeared.

    Lol, it's this damn nVidia letting the side down again! But come on, for $70, what can you expect?

    But in all honesty, I agree with that, the PS3 is going to be expensive and underpowered, but who cares? I've seen rendered footage of what these microscopic transfer rates can achieve, and no games console will play games that only give you 20fps on non-upgradeable hardware, so I still expect good things from it. Hey, at least with constricted performance it won't overheat!!! :D :P

    This ain't gonna stop me buying one.

    5.6.2006 01:20 #49

  • ZippyDSM

    Gazbin
    THe Wii is the most underpowered of them all yet you are buying one without a 2nd thought,also if you bother to stop and think about it the 360 is as crippled as the PS3 add half of all game devs wont touch it wiht a 10 foot poll and the PS3 were it not for the price would be as great to get as the Wii...
    Like I siad befor the fanboys and thier hard loive'n of the PS3 willb eta test the hell out of it and we will know soon enough if there will be any hardware woes,and 360 is just now gettign over its own set of hardware nightmares...

    5.6.2006 05:56 #50

  • sammorris

    yep, as I say I'd rather have a "slow" system than a system that continually overheats and crashes. If my PC did that (well it does both actually, but's because I messed up my heatsink install, and besides it doesn't do one because of another) , I'd change the heatsink. If my games console did that, I'd take it back. No system that is woefully inadequate could render this:



    Could it?

    5.6.2006 06:02 #51

  • ZippyDSM

    sammorris
    thats becuse unlike the PC market the console devs are working hard to get the most out of every bit of Mhz and bit of ramm,the PC market seems to still be full of sloppy devs that need more power *coughcarmackcough*.....

    errrr whatever his name is thre genuis behind DOOM3,we dont need game paly or story lets amaze them with a game they will never forget....unfornately its not the eyecandy we wont forget >>

    5.6.2006 06:06 #52

  • sammorris

    It's the system requirements. I know, Doom 3 was quite bad, but Quake 4 isn't any worse. However they paved the way for some ludicrous games that at some detail levels aren't playable on any current system, be it crossfire or quad sli or whatever you like.

    5.6.2006 06:21 #53

  • ZippyDSM

    As long as the level design and gamepaly evovle from the basic bland ickyness of D3 and Q4,its like buying a new car thats rusted on the inside,these games might have nice shiny paint job but to me they are woefuly lacking.
    F.E.A.R might be repetivity to the 9th power but at its core it is fun and the story was nice to boot,and frankly you cant beat the way they built levels.

    I have a brain...I think......

    Windows Vister
    I dub thee vister untill thee can prove thyself.

    I aint the brightest bulb around but I can feel my way in the dark...

    I fuzzy braind mew =0_o=

    FIGHT THE M.A.F.I.A.A.
    "Music And Film Industry Association of America.."

    5.6.2006 06:33 #54

  • sammorris

    I'd like to be able to play FEAR once I get a new system. I disagree about Doom 3, no matter what people say about it being the same old same old style game, I enjoyed it immensely, in fact I've completed most of it twice (I got to hell, got a bit stuck and then got bored for a bit, then came back and started again and went through to the end). I think some of the levels that other people have made are cool though, particularly stuff like The classic Doom mod etc.

    Athlon XP 3000+, Arctic Cooling Copper Silent2l, MSI MS-6775, 1GB (2x512MB) Nanya-Elixir PC3200 CAS3, 2x WD Caviar SE 250GB S-ATA, Maxtor Diamondmax +8 40GB IDE, Sapphire 256MB Radeon X800 Pro, LG GSA-4163B, SuperFlower SF-464T2-S, Hiper Type-R 480W.
    <logos removed by request of herbsman>

    5.6.2006 06:35 #55

  • ZippyDSM

    sammorris
    the onyl thign I liked about D3 was the story,the PDA was nice to but only half thought out,ever paly System shock 2 you could read and listen to all the notes and stuff you find,and sicne they didnt do a great job on level design SS2 is the better game,I can stand D3 alot more than Q4 ,Q4 is a nearly prefect waste they managed to take Q2 and Q3 and merge them into crap ><

    I might be flamable in my dislike of D3 and Q4 but I am merely holding them to every game I have palyed.
    D3 was kind of fun when I doubled jump and trippled walk,it was fun to move around like you did in the oridgnal games *L*,I cant bring myself to paly Q4 again even with extras and cheats.

    I have a brain...I think......

    Windows Vister
    I dub thee vister untill thee can prove thyself.

    I aint the brightest bulb around but I can feel my way in the dark...

    I fuzzy braind mew =0_o=

    FIGHT THE M.A.F.I.A.A.
    "Music And Film Industry Association of America.."

    5.6.2006 06:40 #56

  • sammorris

    I've yet to play either, and can't wait. Suit yourself, mate I loved it!

    Athlon XP 3000+, Arctic Cooling Copper Silent2l, MSI MS-6775, 1GB (2x512MB) Nanya-Elixir PC3200 CAS3, 2x WD Caviar SE 250GB S-ATA, Maxtor Diamondmax +8 40GB IDE, Sapphire 256MB Radeon X800 Pro, LG GSA-4163B, SuperFlower SF-464T2-S, Hiper Type-R 480W.
    <logos removed by request of herbsman>

    5.6.2006 08:19 #57

  • ZippyDSM

    sammorris
    thats great you can enjoy it I get to costapated palying watered down or annoying games 0-o
    I wish as was mindless with games as I am in real life..I could enojoy thigns better 0-o LOL

    I have a brain...I think......

    Windows Vister
    I dub thee vister untill thee can prove thyself.

    I aint the brightest bulb around but I can feel my way in the dark...

    I fuzzy braind mew =0_o=

    FIGHT THE M.A.F.I.A.A.
    "Music And Film Industry Association of America.."

    5.6.2006 19:55 #58

  • sammorris

    erm, one of these

    ?


    and one of these


    !

    Athlon XP 3000+, Arctic Cooling Copper Silent2l, MSI MS-6775, 1GB (2x512MB) Nanya-Elixir PC3200 CAS3, 2x WD Caviar SE 250GB S-ATA, Maxtor Diamondmax +8 40GB IDE, Sapphire 256MB Radeon X800 Pro, LG GSA-4163B, SuperFlower SF-464T2-S, Hiper Type-R 480W.
    <logos removed by request of herbsman>

    6.6.2006 01:19 #59

  • sammorris

    Me? No trouble at all. In any case, that's a good thing, no need to waste time not playing games by being on the toilet!

    Athlon XP 3000+, Arctic Cooling Copper Silent2l, MSI MS-6775, 1GB (2x512MB) Nanya-Elixir PC3200 CAS3, 2x WD Caviar SE 250GB S-ATA, Maxtor Diamondmax +8 40GB IDE, Sapphire 256MB Radeon X800 Pro, LG GSA-4163B, SuperFlower SF-464T2-S, Hiper Type-R 480W.
    <logos removed by request of herbsman>

    6.6.2006 01:25 #60

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