AfterDawn: News

Oregon Attorney General comes out swinging in RIAA case

Last month the Oregon Attorney General announced that he would help the University of Oregon fight a standard RIAA subpoena that would require them to find and release the identities of 17 students to the RIAA. Now he's going on the offensive, calling RIAA investegatory practices in question and issuing some subpeonas of his own for the trade group's investegators.

According to a motion filed by the Attorney General's office, there are many questions surrounding RIAA tactics, some of which the AG feels may be illegal in Oregon. In fact SafeNet, the company the RIAA pays to find infringers, isn't even licensed to operate in Oregon. The AG argues



The motion also states that RIAA lawyers have refused to answer questions by the AG's office regarding whether they had engaged in data mining to find "personal and confidential information." Now the Attorney General would like to know "precisely how invasive Plaintiffs' investigation was." Specifically, it says "Plaintiffs may be spying on students who use the University's computer system and may be accessing much more than IP addresses."

The motion also requests the court to require the RIAA to "Describe with particularity the economic damage, if any, that the RIAA suffered as a result of the unlawful conduct of each Doe Defendant." This is certainly something that many people would like explained. Of course since the RIAA is normally facing individuals without the deep pockets required to pay for a sustained legal battle they're normally not taken to task for their damage claims.

Depending on whether the judge allows the discovery asked for by the Attorney General, and what answers he gets from RIAA representatives, it seems likely that this will will end up being a landmark case that either signals the beginning of the end of the RIAA's legal jihad or legal justification for even more suits.

Source: Ars Technica

Written by: Rich Fiscus @ 1 Dec 2007 18:49

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• 22 comments

• b18bek9

  Nice to see the riaa is losing more friends in congress. Yea for the Oregons Attorney General in stepping in to see what the riaa is really doing when the investigate and get there info.

  1.12.2007 23:04 #1

• mediabob

  YES. this is going to be a precedent case. im gonna need to follow this!

  1.12.2007 23:29 #2

• ZoSoIV

  hopefully there completely de-funded

  2.12.2007 00:04 #3

• swarmpack

  this should prove to be a good case. please keep us posted on the outcome.

  2.12.2007 05:39 #4

• duckNrun

  RIAA et. al.:
  
  take your business model off life support and let it die with dignity.
  
  Those who have listened to the most important person in the economic model, the customer, have benefited from listening and giving them what they want: music in a format that works on all their devices and lets them use their music the way they always have used it.
  
  The market relies on two factors: Sellers bringing goods and customers interested in buying those goods. If their are no goods then nobody wins. If customers are not willing to buy the goods that are brought or not willing to buy those goods at the listed prices then nobody wins.
  
  Final things to consider:
  --You cannot fight and win the war on piracy by driving away your paying customer base.
  --You can fight but you can never win the war on piracy. Some people will always try to get what they want without paying.
  --Supply and demand are affected by the 'black market'. If the market price is too unbearable people will not buy the goods. For those who are not opposed to such concepts these people will turn to the black market to meet their demand.
  --Demand is limited and when it comes to black market digital copies supply is limitless. A supply and demand curve fail in the face of this fact. An endless supply and limited demand forces the price point to near zero. Near zero is untenable pricing for most businesses. These facts are not fair but these are the facts
  --Those who refuse to face the facts about their business ultimately face a business that fails
  
  The days of taking whatever you can from your customer base has ended. The days where customers give you what they want are upon you. Yes, the days of record profits are over. The gravy train has officially ended. Face the realities of the new music market, aknowledge what your customers are wanting from you, and give them what they want and you will succeed-- maybe not as handsomely as before but you will still exist in the upper tier of societal incomes. Be happy with what you can get.

  2.12.2007 06:25 #5

• hughjars

  Riaa (and the MPAA) cut your losses, kill yourselves.

  2.12.2007 10:00 #6

• duckNrun

  Originally posted by hughjars: Riaa (and the MPAA) cut your losses, kill yourselves.or there is that option too.....lol
  
  ;-)

  2.12.2007 13:33 #7

• Xplorer4

  Quote:"Describe with particularity the economic damage, if any, that the RIAA suffered as a result of the unlawful conduct of each Doe Defendant."
  Seeing as the RIAA did not actually put any money into making the content in question, have they suffered any loss?
  
  Now if there referring to the record company in itself, then let's first be sure that the Doe in question did or did not actually purchase the album/singles after downloading them.

  2.12.2007 16:00 #8

• redux79

  Awesome, someone with actual clout finally broke out the metaphorical bitch be good stick. Looks like the riaa is finally on defensive instead of suing/raping single mothers, college kids, and otherwise defenseless people. I hope the attorney general cracks them a good one.

  2.12.2007 18:05 #9

• emugamer

  The AG must have a kid or friends who have kids who are in this school, which would be great. The absurdity of the Jamie Thomas case surely made everyone shake their head in disbelief. If the industry will go after a single mother for all she is worth and more, then they will definitely show no mercy to a kid in college, probably going after his/her family and all future salaries. You can only push someone so far before they strike back. I just hope it's their death blow.

  3.12.2007 07:15 #10

• MightyOne

  The RIAA will just pay who they need to off to have things their way.
  
  Money talks...BullSh*t walks !!!
  
  Like emugamer says, "You can only push someone so far before they strike back"....hence...what open the doorway to change is if some poor Joe that they shaft just a little to much....SNAPS....heads on over to the RIAA head office...and resorts to a "Killing Spree".
  
  Everyone has a breaking point. Who's first ?

  3.12.2007 10:25 #11

• maryjayne

  I cant wait to hear how the RIAA justifies $26,000 per song (or whatever number they choose). Espicially when each song could have been legally purchased for $0.99, not all of which is going to the RIAA.
  I am sure the RIAA is looking for ways to withdrawl their subpoenas now since their tactic is to submit as many lawsuits as possible and when the court case starts to get too costly, then drop the charges.

  3.12.2007 10:39 #12

• janega

  Time to move to Oregon!!

  3.12.2007 10:57 #13

• spydah

  I'm glad somebodies taken up for the little people.

  3.12.2007 13:50 #14

• 7thsinger

  It's seriously about time someone in the legal system sees the reality that the RIAA's information gathering tactics are bogus if not infringing on people's rights. Good for the Attorney General of Oregon!

  3.12.2007 15:23 #15

• JRude

  I always have held that there is NO JUDICIAL REVIEW in a Court CLERK signing legal papers as a JUDGE should....UNCONSTITUTIONAL! We shall see now, hopefully! ;- )

  3.12.2007 22:42 #16

• morguex

  I'll be following this one to the end.
  It'll be very interesting.
  
  I think the RIAA might just have pissed off the wrong person, or at least I hope they did.
  
  Peace all

  5.12.2007 17:01 #17

• 7thsinger

  Originally posted by morguex: I'll be following this one to the end.
  It'll be very interesting.
  
  I think the RIAA might just have pissed off the wrong person, or at least I hope they did.
  
  Peace allHells Yeah! I'll be watching it all the way as well.
  

  And Shepards we shall be...

  5.12.2007 17:34 #18

• jacksmate

  Originally posted by duckNrun: RIAA et. al.:
  
  take your business model off life support and let it die with dignity.
  
  Those who have listened to the most important person in the economic model, the customer, have benefited from listening and giving them what they want: music in a format that works on all their devices and lets them use their music the way they always have used it.
  
  The market relies on two factors: Sellers bringing goods and customers interested in buying those goods. If their are no goods then nobody wins. If customers are not willing to buy the goods that are brought or not willing to buy those goods at the listed prices then nobody wins.
  
  Final things to consider:
  --You cannot fight and win the war on piracy by driving away your paying customer base.
  --You can fight but you can never win the war on piracy. Some people will always try to get what they want without paying.
  --Supply and demand are affected by the 'black market'. If the market price is too unbearable people will not buy the goods. For those who are not opposed to such concepts these people will turn to the black market to meet their demand.
  --Demand is limited and when it comes to black market digital copies supply is limitless. A supply and demand curve fail in the face of this fact. An endless supply and limited demand forces the price point to near zero. Near zero is untenable pricing for most businesses. These facts are not fair but these are the facts
  --Those who refuse to face the facts about their business ultimately face a business that fails
  
  The days of taking whatever you can from your customer base has ended. The days where customers give you what they want are upon you. Yes, the days of record profits are over. The gravy train has officially ended. Face the realities of the new music market, aknowledge what your customers are wanting from you, and give them what they want and you will succeed-- maybe not as handsomely as before but you will still exist in the upper tier of societal incomes. Be happy with what you can get.

  7.12.2007 22:01 #19

• jacksmate

  Originally posted by duckNrun: RIAA et. al.:
  
  take your business model off life support and let it die with dignity.
  
  Those who have listened to the most important person in the economic model, the customer, have benefited from listening and giving them what they want: music in a format that works on all their devices and lets them use their music the way they always have used it.
  
  The market relies on two factors: Sellers bringing goods and customers interested in buying those goods. If their are no goods then nobody wins. If customers are not willing to buy the goods that are brought or not willing to buy those goods at the listed prices then nobody wins.
  
  Final things to consider:
  --You cannot fight and win the war on piracy by driving away your paying customer base.
  --You can fight but you can never win the war on piracy. Some people will always try to get what they want without paying.
  --Supply and demand are affected by the 'black market'. If the market price is too unbearable people will not buy the goods. For those who are not opposed to such concepts these people will turn to the black market to meet their demand.
  --Demand is limited and when it comes to black market digital copies supply is limitless. A supply and demand curve fail in the face of this fact. An endless supply and limited demand forces the price point to near zero. Near zero is untenable pricing for most businesses. These facts are not fair but these are the facts
  --Those who refuse to face the facts about their business ultimately face a business that fails
  
  The days of taking whatever you can from your customer base has ended. The days where customers give you what they want are upon you. Yes, the days of record profits are over. The gravy train has officially ended. Face the realities of the new music market, aknowledge what your customers are wanting from you, and give them what they want and you will succeed-- maybe not as handsomely as before but you will still exist in the upper tier of societal incomes. Be happy with what you can get.like most tyrants, these (recording industrty)guys are going to fight till the death.. YOURS and MINE if need be..
  Mate

  [img][/img]

  7.12.2007 22:06 #20

• jacksmate

  Originally posted by JRude: I always have held that there is NO JUDICIAL REVIEW in a Court CLERK signing legal papers as a JUDGE should....UNCONSTITUTIONAL! We shall see now, hopefully! ;- )Quote:Everything is bought and paid for... why do you think they can voilate our rights in their quest to frame someone, as they did with the nice lady who never even owned a computer......

  7.12.2007 22:11 #21

• borhan9

  Quote:According to a motion filed by the Attorney General's office, there are many questions surrounding RIAA tactics, some of which the AG feels may be illegal in Oregon. In fact SafeNet, the company the RIAA pays to find infringers, isn't even licensed to operate in Oregon. The AG arguesTrying to get something passed in a state that its not allowed is what is called against the law and hopefully the AG can see this and blow them out of the water.
  
  Quote:The motion also states that RIAA lawyers have refused to answer questions by the AG's office regarding whether they had engaged in data mining to find "personal and confidential information." Now the Attorney General would like to know "precisely how invasive Plaintiffs' investigation was." Specifically, it says "Plaintiffs may be spying on students who use the University's computer system and may be accessing much more than IP addresses."All in all this is an ilegal action its what we call hacking into peoples private systems without notification. If the average computer user can not do this because its against the law organizations like the riaa and mpaa should also obey this law.
  
  If they wish to do this they only way i can see the riaa and mpaa going ahead with infiltrating users computers is by getting a court order that allows them to do that and this case may give them that power lets hope not.
  
  I would like to see where this case leads.

  22.12.2007 17:59 #22