+1 to free speech yay!!
27.3.2008 16:31 #1
Not everyone has the same freedoms, that us Americans, sometimes take for granted.
27.3.2008 16:47 #2
Originally posted by goodswipe: Not everyone has the same freedoms, that us Americans, sometimes take for granted.While some Americans' preach about freedom of speech; they fail to use it correctly.
We all love to use proper punctuation!
27.3.2008 23:23 #3
WTF is this "appeasement" of Islam? If they don't like it that is tough luck. We have the money and we have the oil now so live with it. Enter the 21st century or be damned.. All religion is lies!!
27.3.2008 23:37 #4
You can't sell certain things on EBAY because it's illegal in France or Germany, even though you don't live there! EBAY's website and corporate offices are found in San Jose California USA and not in Europe! Then watch these corrupt geeks traffic in pirated music and phony import albums that do not even exist. Illegal in their own backyard, yes; but these idiots don't care about certain laws enacted by their own government and written by the politicians supported with their campaign contributions.
Google and Yahoo provided information to Chinese police who arrested a bunch of dissidents last year. Better watch it you Tibet agitators; you might be the next ones to be ratted out.
Now You Tube panders to a fascist Islamic regeime with no tolerance for any other religion. Some newspaper in Denmark published a negative cartoon of Mohammed. Those crazy ragheads responded by killing a Roman Catholic priest wit an AK-47 assault rifle in Turkey.
To Hell with another slimey AMERICAN computer company that worships the almighty $$$$$. Their First Amendment isn't worth the rat's azz any more...
28.3.2008 00:17 #5
And youtube rolls over and after learning a new trick, net censorship. How long before all those anti war demos, and officials been caught lying are removed at the bequest of the USA gov?
Many CSpan Vids, But ALL accounts BANNED for posting anti USA videos of Lies Deceit and Abuse of Power.
Quote:Holt Blasts Bush's Disrespect of Americans [video unavailable]
Witness to a war crime - US Marines Shoot Unarmed Civilians [video unavailable]
Apache Helecoptor erases Iraqi Farmers [video unavailable]
US Marine wastes injured Iraqi - War Crime in Iraq [video unavailable]
USA Crimes: The Terrorists bomb a mosque in Iraq! [video unavailable]
The "friendly-fire" death of a British soldier in Iraq. (p1) [video unavailable]
Why We Fight, the Military Industrial Complex [video unavailable]
War Profiteering [video unavailable]
Gonzales: "I Don't Recall" [video unavailable]
I Dont Recall - 72 times [video unavailable]
Bill Moyers On Impeachment Of Bush & Cheney [video unavailable]
MARTIAL LAW PLAN KEPT SECRET FROM CONGRESS [video unavailable]
RUDY GIULIANI CAUGHT LYING *AGAIN* ON DAVID LETTERMAN [video unavailable]
Peter MacKay - SPP "It's a Great Organization" [video unavailable]
Blackwater Shooting At People For Sport [video unavailable]
5-1-07 LAPD ASSAULTS IMMIGRATION REFORM DEMONSTRATORS [video unavailable]
Controversial Video Of St. George, MO Cop part one [video unavailable]
David Snyder Challenges Rogue Mayor of Roseland, Indiana [video unavailable]
Roseland council member David Snyder Attacked By Police [video unavailable]
5-1-07 CLIP 2 LAPD ASSAULTS IMMIGRATION REFORM DEMONSTRATORS [video unavailable]
Ron Paul 1987 Interview On Many Issues We Face Today! [video unavailable]
28.3.2008 03:51 #6
I've been saying this for a while now. All these countries that tell their people when to breath aren't going to last in the 21st century.
28.3.2008 07:09 #7
Originally posted by 21Q: I've been saying this for a while now. All these countries that tell their people when to breath aren't going to last in the 21st century.
AGREED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Shuck that fit. Turkey should have its head cut off, plucked and roasted for infringing on their people's right to voice AGAINST the "Founder" of Turkey. Founder my ass! People don't "found" countries nowadays. That happened when they first learned that the earth wasn't flat. He probably just started their Muslim way of life that now exists in the form of serious punishment when you express dislike towards certain things.
Freedom of speech and expression is serious!!!! This is a non-negotiable. It's a GOD-given liberty. If it wasn't then GOD would have made us unable to say certain words and/or phrases.
Stifling just pisses me off!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
28.3.2008 15:33 #8
Originally posted by cousinkix: You can't sell certain things on EBAY because it's illegal in France or Germany, even though you don't live there! EBAY's website and corporate offices are found in San Jose California USA and not in Europe! Then watch these corrupt geeks traffic in pirated music and phony import albums that do not even exist. Illegal in their own backyard, yes; but these idiots don't care about certain laws enacted by their own government and written by the politicians supported with their campaign contributions.
Google and Yahoo provided information to Chinese police who arrested a bunch of dissidents last year. Better watch it you Tibet agitators; you might be the next ones to be ratted out.
Now You Tube panders to a fascist Islamic regeime with no tolerance for any other religion. Some newspaper in Denmark published a negative cartoon of Mohammed. Those crazy ragheads responded by killing a Roman Catholic priest wit an AK-47 assault rifle in Turkey.
To Hell with another slimey AMERICAN computer company that worships the almighty $$$$$. Their First Amendment isn't worth the rat's azz any more...
if that were true BB guns,air soft guns and swords and knifes would be bannded from ebay, but the rest of it I'd wager is true :P
28.3.2008 15:51 #9
Originally posted by Sazy the Nuub: While some Americans' preach about freedom of speech; they fail to use it correctly.
We all love to use proper punctuation!
28.3.2008 15:58 #10
Originally posted by goodswipe: Originally posted by Sazy the Nuub: While some Americans' preach about freedom of speech; they fail to use it correctly.
We all love to use proper punctuation!
gamer,wat that *lick*
:P
28.3.2008 16:00 #11
YouTube never should have started bending over backwards for these dictatorships. They've started a bad precedent and they need to amend their policy. I guess they're more concerned about losing part of their audience than doing the right thing. That's sad. Actually, I don't understand how they can get away with it, since YouTube is based in the US.
28.3.2008 17:19 #12
Originally posted by cart0181: YouTube never should have started bending over backwards for these dictatorships. They've started a bad precedent and they need to amend their policy. I guess they're more concerned about losing part of their audience than doing the right thing. That's sad. Actually, I don't understand how they can get away with it, since YouTube is based in the US.the same can be said pulling clips off youtube, they can pull anything for any reason, its a free service after all.
28.3.2008 18:33 #13
Originally posted by cart0181: YouTube never should have started bending over backwards for these dictatorships. They've started a bad precedent and they need to amend their policy. I guess they're more concerned about losing part of their audience than doing the right thing. That's sad. Actually, I don't understand how they can get away with it, since YouTube is based in the US.Go out and read about Turkey's political process before posting. I think you will find it is not the dictatorship you think it is.
I have read other posts on here where people make inaccurate comments based upon their ignorance of events, issues and cultures outside of their own. In some ways these posts, whose thoughts are often echoed through the general public, show the true dangers of democracy. When the majority is filled with ignorant, unintelligent, non reasoning, people filled with hate, anger and fear you essentially turn your democracy into mob rule.
On first thoughts I would rather have a 'dictatorship' with Ataturk than a 'democracy' with those who think like cart0181 in the majority.
No offense.
29.3.2008 11:35 #14
the same can be said pulling clips off youtube, they can pull anything for any reason, its a free service after all.Youtube is rolling to oblivion a pay for service beckons hopefully perhaps then they will tackle the endemic paedophile problem on their site instead of pretending it doesn't exists and suspending people who attempt to highlight it.
29.3.2008 11:45 #15
Originally posted by billdoors: the same can be said pulling clips off youtube, they can pull anything for any reason, its a free service after all.Youtube is rolling to oblivion a pay for service beckons hopefully perhaps then they will tackle the endemic paedophile problem on their site instead of pretending it doesn't exists and suspending people who attempt to highlight it.Ah corporate PCisim what a loving thing it is, deny the truth and troll vague injustices to to beat their chest over. (like PCgaming dose with piracy and protections and loss of sales).
29.3.2008 12:14 #16
duckNrun - I'm sorry you took offense to a single word in my post. You must be pretty easy to offend. I did not say that Turkey is a dictatorship, did I? Without researching the political process of Turkey, I was easily able to determine what kind of people are in power there by reading this one, simple news article (above). Reading on such wonderful sites such as Afterdawn is something which educated, not ignorant, people like to do. But back to the article, it explains how the Turkish government blocks access to all of YouTube for posting a single clip which it doesn't like, out of millions of clips. This is very similar to how you took a single word of my post which you didn't like and then misunderstood the entire thing. I encourage you to go back and re-read my original post, substituting the word "governments" for the word you didn't like. I am curious though, how you believe that Democracy, as a form of government, is any more conducive to creating your "dangers" than other forms.
29.3.2008 21:04 #17
cart0181
Or how you use a mindset to force your way of thinking on others :P
*playful jab*
:P
LOL
29.3.2008 21:07 #18
@cart0181:
First off, I did not take a single word out of your post. I took a complete sentence from your post, and the opening sentence to boot. Based upon the content of your post-- how youtube is catering to dictarships as opposed to their users and how this sets a bad precedent--everything you said relates back to that sentence AND that sentence provides the appropriate information describing the content of the paragraph that it was opening.
Quote:I did not say that Turkey is a dictatorship, did I?umm....well....eeerrrrr....thanks for making my point.
Quote:YouTube never should have started bending over backwards for these dictatorships.The topic on hand was Turkey. By using the word 'these', with no other qualifier as to the objects you were referring to- in this case dictactorships- you implied that a subset of the items referred to included the subject at hand which was....Turkey.
Now some may say that instead of you implying that this is so that I was actually inferring that you also meant Turkey. Unfortunately these people would be wrong.
As for the education VS ingnorance of AD users as a whole that is a debate for a different topic and again you should seek out evidence of your thoughts/reasons before posting. A simple search through any number of forums, news articles etc can find any number of ignorant posters AND ignorant comments made by those posters.
Again no offense to any member but come on! EVERYONE knows what I am talking about here!
As for Turkey blocking youtube because there is content on the site that is deemed illegal under local laws EVERY COUNTRY DOES THIS. Adults having sex with 16 year olds is legal in some parts of the world but try to visit those sites from a country which deems it child porn and see what happens to you through your local 'free minded' 'free thinking' government!
One could argue that Turkey is being MORE generous to it's citizenry by going after the site itself instead of it's citizenry who may come across illegal content. And as for the right or wrong of this approach one thing is certain: Their method worked. You Tube caved and removed the content so as to boost their revenue with all of those Turks who were cut off.
I do agree with you that Youtube screwed it's users for the sake of getting more visitors to the site and hence money. Once again we have an American company, on American soil, walking away from the principles of their country so they can whore themselves out for a few extra bucks. They have now joined an exclusive club and should probably contact Yahoo for their membership card to the 'sell people out for a buck club'.
Quote:I am curious though, how you believe that Democracy, as a form of government, is any more conducive to creating your "dangers" than other forms. I didn't state that democracy is more conductive, or poses more risks, than other forms of government. What I did say was:
Quote:In some ways these posts, whose thoughts are often echoed through the general public, show the true dangers of democracy.BUT to answer your question anyways, let me re-iterate what I have already said. Perhaps this may help illuminate the potential risks with a democracy:
Quote:When the majority is filled with ignorant, unintelligent, non reasoning, people filled with hate, anger and fear you essentially turn your democracy into mob rule.This sentiment can be seen EVERY election time in the US. Phrases such as:
If MR. X gets elected the terrorist will attack us again!
Candidate C was raised as a Muslim and was educated in a radical muslim academy!
A woman president would put the country at risk because of her emotions and not being tough enough!
etc etc etc.
Finally (at last) I'm not easy to offend. And if you felt, or sensed, offense then that was you inferring that I was offended and in no way did I intent to imply such. One could have taken my 'no offense' comment at the end to mean either I wasn't offended, I didn't intend on creating offense, or both. Personally, my life is too full with other things to take the time to be offended at what someone I don't know from Adam posts on a message board-- regardless of content.
Again, I mean(t) no offense and none is/was taken; although I will admit that at first glance my closing sentence could be seen as a personal jab. However my intention was to offset that jab with the phrase 'on first thoughts' prior to making the comment to denote that this was only an initial impression and not my 'final thoughts' on the comment that followed it.
Ok, sorry for writing a novel here (lol).
Cheers!
29.3.2008 23:04 #19
To begin with, Turkey was an totalitarian regime when it was first developed, after WWI and the independance war in Anatolia, like the rest of the world except for America and Britian they had liberal ways of governing. When %15-20 of the population know how to read&write, and also without any capital or industrial power authoritarian or totalitarian regimes are maybe better rather than a democratic regime.
After couple of attempts to go in to a democracy with more than 1 party, WWII comes and in the and in 1946 Turkey is not a totalitarian but a democratic country. But the bad thing is Turkey's democracy have never consolidated. It was hit 3 times by army and each time democracy has been paused than continued after 2-3 years which is a vast damage to the regime. after 1980 no military interference was made which is a good signal. After election of 2002 in Turkey, AKP siezed power in the parliment by a percentage of %65 with %35 of the votes because of the non-voters and %10 minimum vote requirement to go to the parliment. Between 2002-2006 AKP have sold many valuable government industries and so but built none, and hide its Islamic part but not that much. so after their 4 and a half year first government, with the money they got truoght seling the countries industries for very low prices, they went to their voters gave coal, brought doctors to the non-urban places, and no any other thing in 4 and a half year, and with more non-voter "I'm fed up with this election people" AKP got %47 vote. Economy just goes worse, with interests' getting higher in banks, Turkey now survives by the Japenese or European retired persons money in Turkish banks because of no production and 5 million unemployed people. isn't this what America wants in Turkey; a weak, soft-islamic republic for The Big Middle East Project.
i must add AKP is a bunch of people with no reasoning and they are just muppets. but the worst is, people of Turkey aren't able to see it. they can't see how bad the economy is, or how stupid the prime minister seems when he talks and the crucial mistakes that AKP have done in health and education policies. Turkey had good writers in its Media but they got killed with bombs to their cars and so, last weekend a very, very important writer İlhan Selçuk ( age 83 ) got in to custody with a sudden operation at 04:30 a.m. without any charges and got released eventually, after 45 hours.
Turkey has big, fundemental problems, and many of them; with an uneducated population and AKP the biggest duechebags of time. Freedom of speech is a minor issue in this small democracy's dont try to think about turkey with the common-sense of developed democracy's of west.
Leave a side nobody wants youtube to be closed the government is just overreacting to the anti-turk nationalist vidoes so that they can get some votes from the nationalist vote pool of turkey. just political bullshit...
30.3.2008 05:29 #20
Originally posted by ZippyDSM: cart0181
Or how you use a mindset to force your way of thinking on others :P
*playful jab*
:P
LOLZippyDSM - First of all, let me just say, I've seen many of your posts and respect your opinion. I am a little confused what you meant by this post or even if it was direct at me. If it was, I will say the only "mindset" I have portrayed here is that American websites should choose to uphold free speech, which is our right here. (or at least it's supposed to be) Matching your jest above, get real, I'm not "forcing" these electrons into your skull right now! lol :P
duckNrun - Okay, there is a lot there to respond to in your post. You're obviously upset that I grouped Turkey in with other countries and referred to them as dictatorships. I admit that is a strong word and so this time I will simply apologize to you for that. Please forgive me, try to see that from my point of view to restrict the populace in this way is dictatorial in my mind. I pray that Turkey will allow peaceful dissent in the future. I assure you, that the intent of my original post was primarily to focus on what I believe to be a poor policy of YouTube, and nothing else.
I admit that in your original post, it appeared that you were, in fact, grouping myself along with others you found to be "ignorant, unintelligent, non reasoning, people filled with hate, anger and fear" and one of the "mob." I thought so, especially after you called me by name as one who "thinks like" one of those people. I hear it is common for an offended person to launch personal insults on their perceived attacker. That's why I thought you were offended, but I guess you're not... and it's good to know you don't think of me like that. After all, like you said, you don't even know me. :)
I still would like to know, though, how you think that a democracy in particular is any more likely to produce this type of person that you don't seem to like very much. And why?
31.3.2008 01:09 #21
