Canadians to pay more for blank CDs

Buyers in Canada will soon be faced with higher prices for blank CDs (CD-Rs), as the Canadian Copyright Board has just increased the levy on the media in an effort to "compensate the music industry for potential duplication of copyrighted material."

The new levies will increase by 38 percent, to 29 cents. The first levy was implemented in 1999 with the intention of helping to compensate the record industry. The idea is that customers will buy blank CDs to duplicate purchased audio CDs or downloaded albums, which will therefore cause massive losses to the music industry and its artists.

Obviously, the Board has not taken into consideration users who will use the CDs to backup their computers or who will copying their own work.

Secretary General of the Copyright Board of Canada, Claude Majeau added: �Two main factors led the Board to raise the CD levy rate to 29�. First, the mechanical royalties that record labels pay to record a song onto a prerecorded CD have increased. Second, because consumers now use compression technology when they record music, the average number of music tracks copied onto a CD went from 15 to more than 18.�

Written by: Andre Yoskowitz @ 14 Dec 2008 17:29

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70 comments

Skweez

That's too hilarious... obviously the government hasn't heard of these little inventions called iPods.... geez.

Typical Canadian government... not in tune with modern technology whatsoever.

Gotta love my tax dollars at work....

14.12.2008 17:58 #1

Tecbot

no kidding i dont know anyone who doesnt own some sort of mp3 player, no big deal to me i have a few hundred packs already laying around to back up stuff since I buy when there on sale for dirt cheap.

14.12.2008 18:16 #2

Ragnarok8

Hmm I dont really use CDs anymore to back up stuff, so they're kinda late on this. All my stuff goes to DVDs, my external HDD and flash sticks. Blu rays cost too much too be used and CDs don't hold enough. Plus their cost to storage ratio is lower than DVDs.

14.12.2008 18:55 #3

core2kid

I've used 2 CDs in the past year for my car. Other than that the 100 pack I bought 2 years ago is still filled.

14.12.2008 18:56 #4

gallagher

I'd like to know how they justify suing or even prosecuting people for copyright infringement if you are already paying for it in advance.

It is like buying insurance, figuring that you will eventually need it, and then having to pay for your damages without the insurance when you do.

14.12.2008 19:33 #5

mogofwar

but wait a minute.... isn't stuff more expensive there then here?

14.12.2008 19:38 #6

sssharp

gallagher very good statement. The catch is the companies sell their problems to the government forcing them to make a new bill/law. Instead of the begging for money(GM,Chrysler) they get the govt to just add taxes to the products to cover their financial problems.

14.12.2008 19:40 #7

logan1957

Why in God's name doesn't the copy right board get their heads out of their asses and realize that the levy isn't to compensate the Really Inept Association of Anal Types for loss of monies due to downloading or making CD's for oneself, it's to keep funding that bunch of losers and their illegal war on downloading that they are losing all over the place. This is nothing more than more BS in the way of corporations screwing the little guy and all the while stabbing him in the back as well.

Here's hoping that the lawsuits in the states especially the class action ones that are beginning to appear against them and their minions bankrupts them and forces them out of business. Our Federal Government instead of bowing to pressure by these special interest, read "RIAA", groups who refuse to come into the 21st Century and work with the consumer, who are their customers, should tell them to get stuffed.

I know if I were PM of Canada the RIAA and the MPAA would both be told to get back on their side of the border and stay there. WE ARE NOT SUBJECT TO THEIR INANE AND ANAL ATTITUDES IN CANADA. But then these morons seem to think that everyone is crooked. Hell, they ought to take a good long look in the mirror if they want to see crooked.

By increasing the levy that we pay on CD's or DVD's all they are doing is assuring that no one will buy them and instead go to flash drives or external drives as well as MP3 players and iPods.

I particularly like the reason they came up with to justify this "increase": "Secretary General of the Copyright Board of Canada, Claude Majeau added: �Two main factors led the Board to raise the CD levy rate to 29�. First, the mechanical royalties that record labels pay to record a song onto a prerecorded CD have increased. Second, because consumers now use compression technology when they record music, the average number of music tracks copied onto a CD went from 15 to more than 18.� "

Prerecorded CD?! There ain't no such animal, you can't prerecord onto a CD, shows just how much Mr. Majeau knows don't it? It also seems that they don't like compression technology either. Hell it's a known fact that the Music Industry is losing money because no one wants to spend money on a CD that has only two good songs on it, but again, this is another moronic idea that the RIAA has come up with and that's another reason that they are losing artists as well to the indie labels because there they have more control over their own music.

14.12.2008 20:27 #8

Morreale

Only time I use a CD is when my dad wants to listen to something... Still uses his old CD player from 10 years ago. Just doesn't want to buy an MP3 player :S

I'm just thinkin', who the hell uses CDs anymore these days(besides the odd person)? Even car stereos now have an Aux In or whatever, MP3 support is standard in almost everything these days. Even for installing things like live CDs, I use DVDs because they are cheaper :S

14.12.2008 21:41 #9

core2kid

Originally posted by Morreale: I'm just thinkin', who the hell uses CDs anymore these days(besides the odd person)? Even car stereos now have an Aux In or whatever, MP3 support is standard in almost everything these days. Even for installing things like live CDs, I use DVDs because they are cheaper :S
Ironically my car has a DVD player and a 6 CD changer but no MP3 support or aux in. It only has a composite in for the TV all the way in the back.

14.12.2008 21:59 #10

ferguj1

Now I remember why I try to avoid reading the news section...because this kind of stupid nonsense just pisses me off. Then I can't really form any kind of coherent thought other than who the hell do they think they are? Before long there will be a tax or levy on everything to compensate someone else who can't manage their affairs on their own.

14.12.2008 22:43 #11

logan1957

Ferguj1: They already have something like that it's called government subsidies for the useless and incompetent, unfortunately you have to be a politician or brain dead to qualify for it.We see it in these foolish taxes and bills that our governments enact to appease an industry that can't seem to realize that their day is long gone and it's the dawning of a new age and their plans and ideas of yesteryear just don't fit in here anymore.

That's why the RIAA has to sue everyone it can think of, only did you notice that they are only suing the low and middle income earners, not the fat cats like themselves or the fat cats kids who download and steal more movies and music than we could in a lifetime cause they know that daddy will run interference for them if caught.

You're right though, this type of news just pisses people off and makes them more determined to rid themselves of these moronic greedy corporations who can't get it through their collective heads that they need to work with the consumer not sue them.

If the class action lawsuits that are being launched against them now by their victims succeed then you'll see them whine and cry and claim it's a miscarriage of justice as all they were trying to do is to survive instead of laying down and dying like the dinosaur they are.

14.12.2008 23:07 #12

Leningrad

dude, when does this law take effect? I wanna stockpile my blank cd pile before this ridiculous law makes me broke.

14.12.2008 23:13 #13

llongtheD

Does anyone still believe the masses are the voice, the lawmakers?
Everyone who believes corporations and their lobbyists have nothing to do with the laws, step forward for a ride on the short yellow bus.
They would have no power without the corrupt politicians though. I guess we should all just keep doing nothing, and continue to bitch.

14.12.2008 23:46 #14

mspurloc

Socialists want your tax dollars so they can waste them.
Media fat cats want your money so they can pocket it when they retire rich.
The people who should matter in this equation, the artists and the citizenry, aren't consulted. They are nothing but cash cows to both groups, working until they drop.

So why do Canadians keep voting in one group when it conspires with the other?
And now, I can ask the same question of Americans.
You're all being played for suckers.

15.12.2008 01:06 #15

eiamhere

Just thought the same. If Canadians are not exempt from prosecution for copyright infringment (which they are not), why is there a levy.

Also, are you able to reclaim your "tax" if you do not use these discs for audio medium?

I'll answer that - no obviously.

Copyright is the cause of, and solution to all of CCB' problems.

15.12.2008 04:17 #16

patrick_

at least it's only a percentage, not like here in Spain where (I don't know cd prices) DVDs cost 20c (TDK / Verbatim) but have over 80c in taxes (that would be 400% taxes - except that it's a fixed rate)

15.12.2008 04:20 #17

borhan9

this is soo crap that because of pirating they have come up with this method to deal with the problem. I don't think my cousins would be too happy.

15.12.2008 04:33 #18

bobiroc

Thats a pretty one sided tax. I mean some people use blank CDs to pirate er... I mean make back up copies of their software media. Maybe I am different than most but I have not played an audio CD in years. I have purchased some but they are immediately ripped to MP3s and stored on my Hard Drive and MP3 player.

I will close by saying that I think the music industry is using piracy as a scapegoat and their main goal is to keep their pockets stuffed with cash. I do not see any big label musicians or their managers/agents or recording labels starving do you? I guess it is hard to keep up the mortgage on their multi-million dollar homes and their car payments on their exotic luxury car. I feel so bad for them. I mean people like us driving around in our chevys and fords and living in our modest little homes or apartments should pay taxes on something that they cannot prove you are using to pirate music. After all Rock Stars (Rap Stars or any other Music Star) have a hard life.

15.12.2008 10:34 #19

mmx4000

Well that makes my life alot easier.

DVDs aren't subject to this levy/tax. That's why in the last few years DVDs are cheaper per disc than CD's. Which makes little sense, but that's the way it is.

So I guess I'll be using DVD's for all applications that call for writing data to a disc, even if it's below 700mb.

So buy DVDs, flash memory, or mp3 players. Do it now before they decide to tax these as well. CD's are out-dated anyways. Let that increase go to waste when nobody buys CD's anymore.

15.12.2008 10:37 #20

emugamer

Wow, absurdity at it's all time peak. This law should have been passed 10+ years ago, when CD burners hit the scene and MP3's were being downloaded directly from sites like allmp3 or p2p via Napster. So how does this work anyway? How much does a CD cost in Canada? It's about $0.07 here in the states. What price per CD are the 10 blank CD-purchasing Canadian customers going to see per CD?

15.12.2008 11:47 #21

gnovak1

Originally posted by bobiroc: Thats a pretty one sided tax. I mean some people use blank CDs to pirate er... I mean make back up copies of their software media. Maybe I am different than most but I have not played an audio CD in years. I have purchased some but they are immediately ripped to MP3s and stored on my Hard Drive and MP3 player.

I will close by saying that I think the music industry is using piracy as a scapegoat and their main goal is to keep their pockets stuffed with cash. I do not see any big label musicians or their managers/agents or recording labels starving do you? I guess it is hard to keep up the mortgage on their multi-million dollar homes and their car payments on their exotic luxury car. I feel so bad for them. I mean people like us driving around in our chevys and fords and living in our modest little homes or apartments should pay taxes on something that they cannot prove you are using to pirate music. After all Rock Stars (Rap Stars or any other Music Star) have a hard life.Very well put. I agree 100%. Musicians make tons on their concert tours and promotional appearences. Cds never really raked up big bucks for musicians anyway. And to make the average consumer pay for the crimes of others is ridiculous.

15.12.2008 13:54 #22

nintenut

Why wouldn't you just buy them online, anyway?

Or can they charge you for that, too?

15.12.2008 13:55 #23

mspurloc

Originally posted by nintenut: Why wouldn't you just buy them online, anyway?

Or can they charge you for that, too?I'm curious about that, too. Does Canada have the Internet sales and badnwidth taxes, as well? Americans will see those next year. Obviously, if they do, they'll pay the tax in the cost, evne if they get them shipped from America.

15.12.2008 14:14 #24

Lee_asdf

I can't wait for this to pass in the US! I should be charged for every homework assignment I burn onto a disc too! The music industry is in a complete shitthole and needs my competely unrelated money!

BTW, this means that I'm paying for whatever I download, So it's LEGAL!...

In all seriousness, I think I would pay 15c for a disc if it meant that whatever I download and burn to it would be completely legal.-- Prepaid CD's! Imagine the possibilities!

15.12.2008 14:57 #25

Cliff1

Yep, and just watch this is a new and larger tax levy on the retail price of CD's in order to pay the royalty charges for access to artists and labels works!

Later on the RIAA, CRB and CRIA will have their lobbyists trying to add additional levies, taxes fines as a legal right for them to collect on their copyrighted works - with no mention of the fees they are collecting off of the retail sales of CDs they collect in this country Canada, it will be as if it doesn't exist, like lat time Industry Minister Jim Prentice made no mention of the money and royalty fees that were being collected from sales of CDs wherby the tax was collected from comsumers!

These folks including our government think we are naive and will come flying open wallets in hand waiting and willing to get screwed!

I am getting sick of this manipulation and gouging and the sooner we push to get rid of these type of agencies that do noting for anyone but line their own pockets the better!

Artists are not getting paid fairly and these agencies have not helped that situation in 50 years we ought to ask our govrnments to abolish these blood suckers!

15.12.2008 15:09 #26

ZippyDSM

I guess they have not of DVD,BD,flash drives and what not, frankly if a government has fair and open fair use rights for its population I would support taxing blank media, industry can not have it both ways...... either ban it gaining the ire of larger industrys or tax it and let the populace do what they want.

15.12.2008 15:16 #27

susieqbbb

This is funny.

You raise the rates of blank media then people will just go online and purchase there media from a outside source and tell you where to go.

15.12.2008 16:04 #28

ZippyDSM

15.12.2008 16:09 #29

They want to add the levy to dvds as well... and not to blu-ray... Go figur...

ah money grab.. what a pain in the ass... i bought a pack of cds and still have 98 left.. go 2 cds in the last 2 years.. wahoo.... dvds i burn throught though 100 last me 1 month but I dont backup data to them to much of a hassle easyer to just buy a drive and clone it instead..

15.12.2008 17:48 #30

ZippyDSM

Originally posted by ads: They want to add the levy to dvds as well... and not to blu-ray... Go figur...

ah money grab.. what a pain in the ass... i bought a pack of cds and still have 98 left.. go 2 cds in the last 2 years.. wahoo.... dvds i burn throught though 100 last me 1 month but I dont backup data to them to much of a hassle easyer to just buy a drive and clone it instead..Sin taxes are meant to mitigate a right, by pushing for heavy CP reform and taxes thats a ridiculous double whammy the p[people should not stand for.

15.12.2008 17:51 #31

windsong

15.12.2008 18:56 #32

Blessedon

If I burn my music to a CD for which I paid a tax that was paid to a private company;
Doesn't that make my music CD legal because the company has now received fair compensation?
Why couldn't I argue in court that I have already paid them?

15.12.2008 19:01 #33

ZippyDSM

15.12.2008 19:03 #34

TBandit

What if you purchase them online? Do they add it to the total.

16.12.2008 04:04 #35

lvhawk

This is a perfect opportunity for the blackmarket to shine. Screw the tax, go to your local fleamarket. Better yet, this would make a good investment opportunity, buy up a couple hundred dollars worth, wait til the tax is applied, sell at your local fleamarket. What a great country!

16.12.2008 09:23 #36

rlessmue

Quote:Originally posted by ads: They want to add the levy to dvds as well... and not to blu-ray... Go figur...

ah money grab.. what a pain in the ass... i bought a pack of cds and still have 98 left.. go 2 cds in the last 2 years.. wahoo.... dvds i burn throught though 100 last me 1 month but I dont backup data to them to much of a hassle easyer to just buy a drive and clone it instead..How do you "clone" a drive? Any apps?If you are looking to "clone" a drive, here are some suggestions:
Acronis True Image will make an exact copy of your hard drive...boot sector and all! It works great on XP (have not tried it on Vista).

Here is the link to their site: http://www.acronis.com/

If you want to just copy your data from one hard drive to another
without copying the "operating system", a good program called "TeraCopy" works good for that. It allows a "buffer" to ensure that
when your files are copied they are complete. If it has an error during the copy process it will tell you. Here is there website:
http://www.codesector.com/teracopy.php (free for home users).

Hope this helps!

Cheers!

16.12.2008 13:40 #37

Hallicon

So now I'm paying for the right to duplicate copyrighted material? Thanks for the encouragement Copyright Board of Canada!

16.12.2008 15:07 #38

subpopz

CD's are now an outdated media. Who seriously does a ton of 'backing-up' music on to CD's anymore?

I can slap many, many more times the amount of songs on a digital media card (which costs substantially less than CD's)

What I'm saying is....who cares?

16.12.2008 16:36 #39

Blessedon

Originally posted by subpopz: Who seriously does a ton of 'backing-up' music on to CD's anymore?

I can slap many, many more times the amount of songs on a digital media card (which costs substantially less than CD's)

What I'm saying is....who cares?I care. I have CD players. I have CDs. I like the medium and I intend to keep it.

16.12.2008 17:38 #40

rlessmue

Originally posted by subpopz: CD's are now an outdated media. Who seriously does a ton of 'backing-up' music on to CD's anymore?

I can slap many, many more times the amount of songs on a digital media card (which costs substantially less than CD's)

What I'm saying is....who cares?...Wow! Where do you shop! LOL!
I do agree that CD's are outdated media, but they are a lot cheaper
than a digital media card! You must be using the "new math" system...
================
Just do the cost per mb...
On the web I found 100 cd's for $38.00 (this is still too high!)
http://www.universaltapes.com/prod-cdr-inkjet/TYCDR80P.html
And I found storage cards here (these are ok prices):
http://www.meritline.com/sdhc-card1.html...CFRg6awodwjKPSA
================
So 1 cd can store 700mb at the cost of .38 cents.
2 cd's can store 1.4 gig = .76 cents.
3 cd's can store 2.1 gig = $1.14
4 cd's can store 2.8 gig = $1.52
5 cd's can store 3.5 gig = $1.90
6 cd's can store 4.2 gig = $2.28
7 cd's can store 4.9 gig = $2.66
8 cd's can store 5.6 gig = $3.04
9 cd's can store 6.3 gig = $3.42
10 cd's can store 7.0 gig = $3.80
20 cd's can store 14.0 gig = $7.60
... and so on.
===========================================
Look, CD's are a cheap media and they are still beating (cost/mb)
with any digital media card (cost/mb)...that I can find.

-Also not that digital media cards -can- loose their "memory" and
become corrupt over time..."bleading" seems to occur as one issue.
Just "google" for it...there are examples all over the web...example:
http://forums.dvdfile.com/game-hardware/...rd-corrupt.html
===========================================

If you don't enjoy listening to your earlier music you have collected
and keep *reusing* your digital media cards to put on your new music,
yes...it is cheaper. But if you are going to "archive" your music, so
you can listen to it later...in about 10 years, your "burned" CD will
"most likely" out perform your digital media card - due to "zero"
chances of "memory leaks" or "bleeding" that might happen!

============================================
Cheers!

http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/mm112/gobble3666/attemptingtogiveadamn0uc.gif

16.12.2008 18:24 #41

XENON

All i say is 'meh' I don't really care If I have to pay this levy. I'm still able to download copyright material so long as I don't share it. (it's safely stored in an encrypted hidden folder in an external hard drive...all 100+ gigs of it! This doesn't bother me any, but I do sympathize with those that it does affect especially with the economy the way it is right now.

Here's a question and something AD should look into: With the economy tanking, will that result in a significant increase in piracy and torrent downloads?

16.12.2008 18:25 #42

rlessmue

Originally posted by XENON: All i say is 'meh' I don't really care If I have to pay this levy. I'm still able to download copyright material so long as I don't share it. (it's safely stored in an encrypted hidden folder in an external hard drive...all 100+ gigs of it! This doesn't bother me any, but I do sympathize with those that it does affect especially with the economy the way it is right now.

Here's a question and something AD should look into: With the economy tanking, will that result in a significant increase in piracy and torrent downloads?
==================
History has shown whenever the economy is tanking, people try to save where they can. Downloads and Piracy of *Anything* on-line will be increased...without question...mostly due to how the Internet has changed in the last 10 years. Retail is down in the shops, but retail
is up in sales on the Internet. Why? Save $$$$. The percentage of
increase should be significant...but I would not expect it to happen
all at once...I believe that it will depend upon how long the economy
will be tanking....sigh.

http://i294.photobucket.com/albums/mm112/gobble3666/attemptingtogiveadamn0uc.gif

16.12.2008 18:52 #43

subpopz

Quote:If you don't enjoy listening to your earlier music you have collected
and keep *reusing* your digital media cards to put on your new music,
yes...it is cheaper. But if you are going to "archive" your music, so
you can listen to it later...in about 10 years, your "burned" CD will
"most likely" out perform your digital media card - due to "zero"
chances of "memory leaks" or "bleeding" that might happen!

yes, and if you don't use those CD's at all they will be in pristine condition. In all likelihood, they will get used, and over the course of years of use, they will get scratched, damaged, yadda, yadda.
Whereas, if I lose a few songs off a digital storage, wow, I guess I have to waste all of 15 mins re-downloading them in their original pristine quality. And since technology will have advanced yet again who knows how many times over in that amount of time, chances are I will have new media and players to put them on.
Back-ups of music are pointless.

16.12.2008 21:21 #44

chrissd

Actually, CDs are fairly useful. Live discs don't work so well using dvds and installing onto a portable hdd defeats the purpose. And for a more permanent form than a memory stick with reasonable transfer/burn speeds. And they work in more dvd players than dvds for a photo slideshow that you can send to relatives to pretend you care. lolz

16.12.2008 21:35 #45

aragorn29

Wow, I think most of you are missing the point here. This levy has kept downloaders safe from organizations like the RIAA & CRIA for years. Not one single successful "piracy" lawsuit brought against a Canadian citizent over downloaded music. The Copyright Board of Canada has included downloading music in the list of "private copying" activities for which tariffs on blank media applied. See here. I'll glady continue to pay this levy and be thankful for the protection it offers me.

16.12.2008 23:20 #46

hermes_vb

I can get a good 1 TB Hard Drive for less than $100. It's kinda ridiculous don't you think?

17.12.2008 04:24 #47

mjlambert

Originally posted by susieqbbb: This is funny.

You raise the rates of blank media then people will just go online and purchase there media from a outside source and tell you where to go.What is shitty for most Canadians is the importing to Canada exspecially from the USA. Most companies wont ship US Postal they always insist on Fedex or UPS which shipping to Canada can then add on a $30+ brokerage fee.

Sometimes the shipping and brokerage is just not worth it for us.

17.12.2008 09:22 #48

eljay

Originally posted by mjlambert:
What is shitty for most Canadians is the importing to Canada exspecially from the USA. Most companies wont ship US Postal they always insist on Fedex or UPS which shipping to Canada can then add on a $30+ brokerage fee.

Sometimes the shipping and brokerage is just not worth it for us.I've been wondered about this as well. I live in Denmark, and a lot of stuff is much cheaper for us to buy in the U.S., even when you add customs and VAT. But the shipping costs will often make it to expensive.

On topic: We've had a blank media tax in Denmark since around the same time as it was introduced in Canada. It's currently a fixed tax of around .30 USD on CD's and .55 USD on DVD's, but it used to be much higher, and based on the capacity of the media. DVD's used to have around 2.50 USD tax on them, but the taxing model was changed a few years ago, to combat the extensive import of media from countries like Germany, that has no tax on blank media. It's still cheaper to import though, and it's perfectly legal too.

17.12.2008 10:53 #49

mjlambert

Yes shipping is not allways great for most of us.

In Canada if we can get the item shipped here via US Postal it works out very well for us as we just need to pay the taxes on the declared value.

However most companies insisting on shipping via Fedex or UPS as they already have accounts setup with them and its less hassel than going to the post office and that sort of thing. However to bring that package into canada it has to have a broker and they charge $30 per package for brokerage fee's sometimes more.

I also feel that we are being treated unfairly! I mean while yes alot of pirecy goes on man of us use CD media for much more than just that.

I am a professional photographer and between my data backs, Proofs for clients and wedding cd's in general i go through thousands a year and it adds up.

17.12.2008 11:08 #50

windsong

Speaking of shipping to Canada from U.S....anyone look at newegg.ca? Shipping charges as well as prices are through the f'ing ROOF. Seriously thinking about moving back to the states (I live in Ontario..it SUCKS).

17.12.2008 13:38 #51

Leningrad

Originally posted by aragorn29: Wow, I think most of you are missing the point here. This levy has kept downloaders safe from organizations like the RIAA & CRIA for years. Not one single successful "piracy" lawsuit brought against a Canadian citizent over downloaded music. The Copyright Board of Canada has included downloading music in the list of "private copying" activities for which tariffs on blank media applied. See here. I'll glady continue to pay this levy and be thankful for the protection it offers me.well guess your right, the only problem is for people that write thier own music.

17.12.2008 23:10 #52

eljay

If you have a business in Denmark, you can actually get a refund on the tax, if you only use the media for your own material. So I guess composers, photographers and others, who use a lot of CD/DVD's could just register a personally owned company, and avoid the tax that way. Many of them probably do that anyway.

17.12.2008 23:22 #53

Mez

I am sure the RIAA goes after rich and poor. The rich are smart enough to get good lawyers so the RIAA has to back off. Their half -ass attacks are easily challanged. They have the problem, to make an air tight case they need to break the law. I suspect now they are not trying to make a good case. Instead they go after more persons and drop the cases that are defended by a good lawyer.

Why would you think Canada would have a better class of law makers than the rest of the world? I am sure they were paid good money for their work. Be happy that they are taxing the wrong item. Are you all stupid? Do you really what them to tax ipods and DVDs? Lucky for you they can't read. Otherwise they might be getting ideas by reading this thread.

18.12.2008 08:30 #54

garmoon

So for a measly .08 cents per disc, Canada is going to pi$$ off the whole of it's citizenry! LMAO ! Watch what they are going to do to NY state. Tax everything!! NY is broke.

18.12.2008 19:36 #55

chrissd

Originally posted by aragorn29: Wow, I think most of you are missing the point here. This levy has kept downloaders safe from organizations like the RIAA & CRIA for years. Not one single successful "piracy" lawsuit brought against a Canadian citizent over downloaded music. The Copyright Board of Canada has included downloading music in the list of "private copying" activities for which tariffs on blank media applied. See here. I'll glady continue to pay this levy and be thankful for the protection it offers me.So the tax means that copying is allowed? Niiiiiiice. Given current copyright laws, just ripping a cd to mp3 to put on portable player is illegal. So that is actually a really good idea. And so worth paying.

18.12.2008 21:02 #56

Mez

chrissd, only the RIAA contends ripping CDs is illegal. The copyright laws of most countries protect personal copies of copywrited material. Otherwise the libraries would need to go to jail. They actually provide copy machines to copy copyrighted material.

I did not fully take in aragorn29 statement. Even though tens of thousands of person have been 'wacked' for file sharing it has not been deturmined in court that P2P is not copying for personal use because only one case went to court. That case has never been resolved. The RIAA was able to prove Jamie Thomas in fact used P2P. They failed to prove that she broke the law. Her defence contends she did so for personal use which is not agaist the law. I suspect that case will never go to court.

Maybe CA has the only smart law out there. P2P is a grey area of the law. Tax it and do not clog up the courts with P2P garbage.

19.12.2008 08:27 #57

FrostRose

CD as a media grows old. Just Accept the fact. Nowadays OS/games/ect are all orginally in either DVD or something other than CD or older medias.

CD like media will keep on going, but I'm wordering when will they stop using CD as media in music industry? LP--->C-kasset--->CD--->Internet--->????

I don't personally give a crap about blank CD prices. I've got 400 blank DVD's and they cost me less than 130� and virtually have 1720Gb worth of space. Thats about 1.68Tb worth of space.

It's just that some files are to be cut in pieces to fit then even to the DVD's. Take example Raw record file of a 3 hour long match in 8mbps. I'm not sure if it would even fit to a dual-layer DVD.

19.12.2008 21:58 #58

ZippyDSM

Originally posted by FrostRose: CD as a media grows old. Just Accept the fact. Nowadays OS/games/ect are all orginally in either DVD or something other than CD or older medias.

CD like media will keep on going, but I'm wordering when will they stop using CD as media in music industry? LP--->C-kasset--->CD--->Internet--->????

I don't personally give a crap about blank CD prices. I've got 400 blank DVD's and they cost me less than 130� and virtually have 1720Gb worth of space. Thats about 1.68Tb worth of space.

It's just that some files are to be cut in pieces to fit then even to the DVD's. Take example Raw record file of a 3 hour long match in 8mbps. I'm not sure if it would even fit to a dual-layer DVD.Ya but DVD is enxt...

20.12.2008 00:03 #59

lawndog

I see severeal people hate this idea.
But remember blank tapes?? There was a tax on them to be funneled to the record industry. This could be better in the long run. It is possible for the RIAA and MPAA to be a little bit more leniente regarding pirates if they are getting money via blank cd/dvd sales. It could be that the industry is realizing that they'll never stop pirates, so why not pass the troubles onto the cd manufactors, via higher costs.

20.12.2008 14:09 #60

ZippyDSM

Originally posted by lawndog: I see severeal people hate this idea.
But remember blank tapes?? There was a tax on them to be funneled to the record industry. This could be better in the long run. It is possible for the RIAA and MPAA to be a little bit more leniente regarding pirates if they are getting money via blank cd/dvd sales. It could be that the industry is realizing that they'll never stop pirates, so why not pass the troubles onto the cd manufactors, via higher costs.I do not see a problem with a reasoanble tax on data storage devices as long as the media nazis stop pestering the populace with their inept MP police.

20.12.2008 14:12 #61

lawndog

thats kinda my hope in the long run. The RIAA and MPAA have been unSUCKSessful, as well they should be, in the courts going after so called pirates. My hopes are that the money that would be generated via the tax would be enough to coat there seemingless bottomless pockets. P2P is here to stay no matter what governing properties thinkk or try to do. The so called pirate killer blu-ray has already been cracked, although theres a newer program, it's only a better of time before it gets cracked to.
No matter how smart they think they are, others are always smarter.
So now with this develpment they can still get their (RIAA, MPAA) money, while the general consumer can still do what they do, whether they like it or.
To me it seems like an almost win/win

20.12.2008 14:32 #62

ZippyDSM

Originally posted by lawndog: thats kinda my hope in the long run. The RIAA and MPAA have been unSUCKSessful, as well they should be, in the courts going after so called pirates. My hopes are that the money that would be generated via the tax would be enough to coat there seemingless bottomless pockets. P2P is here to stay no matter what governing properties thinkk or try to do. The so called pirate killer blu-ray has already been cracked, although theres a newer program, it's only a better of time before it gets cracked to.
No matter how smart they think they are, others are always smarter.
So now with this develpment they can still get their (RIAA, MPAA) money, while the general consumer can still do what they do, whether they like it or.
To me it seems like an almost win/winThus why I think a profit via multiple license,basically they contract out licensees and get X amount of the profit thats made forget price schemes and whatnot put that cost on the retailer/seller and them price it as they need it to stay in buissness, a true free market demand will automatically keep prices at a level everyone can make a profit off of. Focusing on the "profit model" IE multiple streams of smaller but more numerous steames of revenue would be more correct for media, a distribution focus is silly as stuff can not be protected but for cases of illicit profit.

20.12.2008 14:41 #63

lawndog

um theres alot of big words there that confuse me.
But I think we agree????
oh wait reread it......
do you think a genral prices not a tax would be better suited???
like per say....
Cd bundle cost $25.00 regualer tax of 8.25%
but a fraction of the initial $25.00 goes to the money groubling whores???

20.12.2008 14:46 #64

ZippyDSM

Originally posted by lawndog: um theres alot of big words there that confuse me.
But I think we agree????
oh wait reread it......
do you think a genral prices not a tax would be better suited???
like per say....
Cd bundle cost $25.00 regualer tax of 8.25%
but a fraction of the initial $25.00 goes to the money groubling whores???
A tax, or percentage of the total retail price is fine.

==========================================

Oh sorry I have all these unfinished ideas in my head and they come out worse since I suck at grammar, I am drooling about changing the nature of Copy right from a distribution based model where the rights owner has absolute control over the distribution of the CP but for limited instances of first sale,used and what not, to a profit based model where the rights owners have absolute right to profit off the profit off the CP, this makes it so free distribution is hard to touched it also allows for wider user content,parodies,fair use and a kind of public domain status for anything thats given away for free.
------------------------------------

20.12.2008 14:54 #65

lawndog

ah ok i gotcha now.
I always found it odd that places that resell cds/dvds/games don't ever come under scrutiniy from governing entities. IE: blockbuster/movie trading company/used stuff on amazon/gamestop???
what makes them so special, is it because the have a tax??
Ah who knows big corporations have always screwed the little guys

20.12.2008 15:02 #66

ZippyDSM

Originally posted by lawndog: ah ok i gotcha now.
I always found it odd that places that resell cds/dvds/games don't ever come under scrutiniy from governing entities. IE: blockbuster/movie trading company/used stuff on amazon/gamestop???
what makes them so special, is it because the have a tax??
Ah who knows big corporations have always screwed the little guysThe bigger rental chains have a license contract of some kind with big media, ma and pa outfits don't need such a cumbersome contract as far as I know.

In a sense its the profit based model I have in mind instead of the rights holder making/publishing 90-100% of the media packages, license it out and gain multiple revenue streams instead of a few larger ones.

AS far as I can see the tax would be placed the retail packaged blank media, the way taxes work 1-5% of the tax goes into management of the taxation system, hell with computerized retail the industry could easily add 5-10% for the "tax" and send in the tribute to big media with statistics of sales and what not.

A voluntary "tax" system for profit shareing is not a bad idea even more so if the larger compines would make better incentives to get retail and ma and pa outlets to come join and be part of the system.

As I see it the current retail/CP system makes more bloated and lazy companies more apt to slow growth and stagnant art and the industry than anythign sale.

20.12.2008 15:14 #67

elseany

Quote:Originally posted by susieqbbb: This is funny.

You raise the rates of blank media then people will just go online and purchase there media from a outside source and tell you where to go.What is shitty for most Canadians is the importing to Canada exspecially from the USA. Most companies wont ship US Postal they always insist on Fedex or UPS which shipping to Canada can then add on a $30+ brokerage fee.

Sometimes the shipping and brokerage is just not worth it for us.that reminds me of one time going from canada to the states there was this lady that got charged $400 for brining an orange down. was it not like the orange wasnt grown in the US anyway?

that doesnt make sense to me.

23.12.2008 00:54 #68

ZippyDSM

Quote:Quote:Originally posted by susieqbbb: This is funny.

You raise the rates of blank media then people will just go online and purchase there media from a outside source and tell you where to go.What is shitty for most Canadians is the importing to Canada exspecially from the USA. Most companies wont ship US Postal they always insist on Fedex or UPS which shipping to Canada can then add on a $30+ brokerage fee.

Sometimes the shipping and brokerage is just not worth it for us.that reminds me of one time going from canada to the states there was this lady that got charged $400 for brining an orange down. was it not like the orange wasnt grown in the US anyway?

that doesnt make sense to me.For some things it brings over disease the region is not use to and create huge problems, when imported via a importer they spray and do other things to limit biological contamination.

Altho the more they out source such things they should just charge a flat fee for bringing it in youerself...

I know my aunt and uncle brought back 20 bottles of Okanagan cider, the airline charged them 30$ for the weight of their suit cases hehehe

23.12.2008 01:01 #69

XENON

yeah you can't bring any foreign food whether from the US or up here in Canada to either place (us > Canada, Canada > us) I remember being at Pearson Airport (Toronto International) and someone didn't declare their bag full of turkish delight from his grandfather (he just came back form Turkey) they found the bag just full of beetles. So not only did he have to throw away his sweets he was also busted for not declaring it and some other charge (can't remember) had to pay over a 1,000 bucks for duty and fines!

23.12.2008 19:08 #70

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